And Now We Drink Episode 251 with Christoph Paul

Drinking on the podcast this week is the founder of Clash Books, The lead singer/ Bassist of The Dionysus Effect and author Christoph Paul. Christoph and Matt Slayer talk about the origins of Clash Books, the inspiration for The Dionysus Effect's hit song Darryl. Wild fiction Christoph has written under his pen name and much much more.

• Transcript

  Matt Slayer Hey. Welcome. Cheers. By the way. Welcome to the humble abode.

  Christoph Paul Cheers.

  Matt Slayer Thank you for doing the show.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, thanks for having me on.

  Matt Slayer My absolute pleasure. Not only did you make the long commute across country, you made the long commute across fucking L.A..

  Christoph Paul So that's this dude. Fucking traffic here is. I feel like I'm in fucking Jumanji or something. Do doing. Just going from Santa Monica to here. Everything takes extra hour. It's wild.

  Matt Slayer Yeah. Well, we're setting this up, and really, I'm coming from San Marcos. Not too far. Like, I'm not going to say anything. May jinx the show from happening.

  Christoph Paul This is, like, five different countries and one little city. Well, not big city, actually. It's pretty big, but, yeah, that's what it feels like.

  Matt Slayer Oh, and you haven't even, like, made it into the valley or the remote parts that are still technically fucking L.A..

  Christoph Paul Yeah. No, but it's good to be here. Thank you for having me on.

  Matt Slayer Again, my absolute pleasure. And doing the little bit of research I did for the show. Believe it or not, audience. I actually did a little research for this one half time. I just like, let's just get into it. I feel like your band has the only song about Cuckolding that I think exists in Nice.

  Christoph Paul I like it on radio. I'm like, I'm glad I did this interview. Straight to the good shit. Yeah. No, it's kind of funny. Like, I guess I'm, you know, I don't want to be called Cock Rock. You know, that's probably not marketable, but. Oh.

  Matt Slayer I mean, ironically.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. You know, we. Yeah, Darryl is. I mean, Darryl kind of sums it all up. You know what I do? Because, you know, my day job is being a publisher, and my passion is doing music, and I wrote a fucking cuckold rock anthem, and you know, I'm proud of that. I'm proud of that song. I think it's a good song.

  Christoph Paul You know, the book actually talked about, and that was the seed of the song is like There's No Cuckold rock songs. And that that stayed with me. And then all of a sudden, I was like, data and dot. And then it's like, Hey, Darrell. And then I was like, Oh, the song's fucking written.

  Matt Slayer So and you mentioned GHB in the audience.

  Christoph Paul So that's in the book. The Guy, The Cuckold. Darrell loves GHB. It's his drug of choice. I have to give a shout out to Jackie as fucking brilliant writer. Like, my goal is like, you know, if I can do a song that's half as good as this book, this is going to be a pretty good song. So it's all about Jackie.

  Christoph Paul She's a brilliant writer. I was lucky enough to work with her, but the guys were like, You wrote a Cuckold song? I'm like, Dude, just. Just hear it. And, you know, it's been getting it. Got some love from. Got to give a shout out to Loudwire. That's like a pretty good magazine, to say the least. And, you know, it's wild.

  Christoph Paul It's you never know, man. Like, you would have told me a couple of years ago, I would get a loudwire blurb for a rock song about a cuckold. You know, that's life, man. That's life.

  Matt Slayer It's so wild. Have anyone who uses a derogatory term, like, attach themselves to the song at all? You got any feedback from it?

  Christoph Paul Not Well, we did. Yeah, yeah, we've got there's the other band called themselves Cock Rock, but they're, like, doing weird, like, indie rock. So I guess, like, guys have called them, like, you guys are cocks and they've, like, embraced it. But now I'm, you know, the actual cuckold have yet to go. You know, it's funny, I need to because I want to, like, get some more marketing going.

  Christoph Paul So I'm thinking about going on Reddit and, like, putting and in the cuckold sex and like, I'll do it under like a pen name, but like, check out there's a cuckold anthem. You know, they need representation, too, you know? I mean, it's a funny term because I remember there is that movie cock that came out which was I got to admit, it was a look.

  Christoph Paul No, no disrespect to the director. It was not a good movie, but I found it funny, like, in that like ridiculous way. And it is just such a fucking huge word. Everybody was like, you're a cock, man. You're a cock. I feel like that term has died down. I don't know. What do you think?

  Matt Slayer Like, I mean, it's still here, but still here. It's mostly with 12 year olds. I'm fucked. They don't have how.

  Christoph Paul Like it's it just keeps getting lower till like now the 13 year old at Lord's instead of like the 22 year elder.

  Matt Slayer Yeah. The 13 year olds like you talk about you haven't even seen a fucking vagina. Who are you talking to.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. Yeah but.

  Matt Slayer And I'm not here to shame people that are legitimately into it either.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. No I mean I, you know one of my day jobs was I was a porn store clerk for about two years. This was a while ago. It was like I was young, young and, and it was mostly, predominantly like older black men that would come in and there was just like this one white dude that would always come in and every time he got a cuckold video and I was like, and he had cuckold vibe.

  Christoph Paul Like, you could tell that was his whole thing. And, you know, no shame, you know, if that's your thing. You know, I asked this. I remember I used to do the podcast game back in the day, and I had this really cool season to, like, kink and Fetish Dvora Gray shout out to Dvora, and I asked her, I'm like, you know, are cockles weak or strong?

  Christoph Paul And she said, you know, they're actually alphas and I was like, What? And she's like, These are that. She said, These are the guys that have enough strength. So to deal with their, you know, wife fucking better guys and all that or their girl. And I don't know if I still agree with that, but it was an interesting perspective.

  Matt Slayer Well, it takes something like, Oh, hey, not only am I okay with you fucking other people, but I get off on watching you receive pleasure.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. And like feeling inadequate. There's a whole other thing with that. I mean that, you know, and I mean like in the song, I only feel alive when someone better is inside of her. And it's like there is a whole psychology that's probably it's really fascinating with cockles, you know, and it's funny. I mean, like, I live this life, you know, doing the book last year came out because we're we're aware we were in April, so it came out like the year anniversary is coming up for the Darryl Cuckold anniversary for the book.

  Christoph Paul And now it's as his whole new life as a song. So I've cuckold God bless the couple. They've done good things for my life.

  Matt Slayer Do you feel like you succeeded? If Darrell becomes a new, like, derogatory term for a cuckold.

  Christoph Paul You know, I feel like Darrell. Yeah, you're a Darrell. Wow. I never even thought of that. I think Jackie should get credit for that, not me. I mean, Jackie was the one, but, you know, and that was the other thing, too. The book, you know, like, it's interesting, as a musician with a day job, I you know, like most musicians have, we have shitty day jobs, you know, and I actually have lucked out.

  Christoph Paul I have a weird skill. You know, you had Salinger on. I'm actually his editor. I'm actually good at editing books. It's the one marketable skill I have. I don't have any other marketable skills. I'm just like, oh, this book should do that. And so instead of, like, working at fucking Kinko's or, you know, Starbucks, I'm an our guitar center, which is the which is a good job for musicians.

  Christoph Paul There's worse fucking job, a bar bartender or a guitar center. I'm actually an editor, so I just have I'm lucky to have a decent semi cool job while making music, but all the props go to Jackie. She's she's the queen.

  Matt Slayer All right, so you heard it here, folks. If Darryl becomes your Darryl, we're giving it to Jack.

  Christoph Paul Give it to Jackie. She's starting that. Yeah.

  Matt Slayer We'll bring that back to Jackie. Let her know.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, I'll let her know. She'll probably listen to this. I'll be like, hey, we talked about Darryl. She's cool is she's an awesome person.

  Matt Slayer I don't think anyone who writes a book about cuckolding is an uncool person, like.

  Christoph Paul She's the best. I mean, like, that's the first. The first chapter I. I read this chapter, a friend gave it to me, and she's like, pissed off, and she's the shout out to her. Lindsay Luhrmann and lindsay luhrmann is like this. She's a serious she's a Ph.D. philosophy, like, just eloquent you know, she just, like, for whatever reason, that she knows where publishing's the fucking shit hole she should have been publishing with us, like, she should have been with a way better for us.

  Christoph Paul But, you know, we got her and I'll say I'm happy we got her. She's like, you know, my friend Jackie, she wrote this book. It's it's really readable. I don't want to say too much, but I think you might be into this it's very transgressive. And I go, right, you know, we'll see. And I read this first page, and it's about this guy named Darryl talking about how he needs to see his wife.

  Christoph Paul Fuck LeBron James. And it's the greatest opening chapter ever. I was like, unless this totally falls apart, I'm publishing this book. I mean, it was just and I'm a I'm a huge sports guy, too. So it was just like, all right, where I'm in, I'm in. And you know.

  Matt Slayer What was for the audience? Does she succeed? Does she get LeBron?

  Christoph Paul He doesn't get LeBron. I feel like that's that's okay. I can you know, I can. And he didn't even make the playoffs or sad for LeBron. Sorry. Are you a Lakers fan? I'm not here. You don't give a shit about it. Yeah, right.

  Matt Slayer Yeah. I'm originally from Chicago and like, I enjoyed the Dynasty Bulls, but otherwise.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, you're like, whatever.

  Matt Slayer Yeah. But the only sports I get into are, like sweaty men punching each other.

  Christoph Paul That's cool. I can respect that. But yeah, no, I mean, is fun is a fun book to edit and put out. And, you know, a song came out of it and hey, here we are talking about Darryl's and called I. What? What a great life.

  Matt Slayer Right? Who would have thought ten, 20 years ago like this would be a topic of conversation for talk radio?

  Christoph Paul Yeah. We're in exciting times. That's the I'm an optimist, you know, I think we're, you know, there's a lot of terrible shit going on in the world, but there's also beautiful moments like this, you know?

  Matt Slayer Yeah, I agree. But this is still not the dystopia I signed up for.

  Christoph Paul Now, no, that's true. That's true.

  Matt Slayer I want fucken blade runner neon lights.

  Christoph Paul Everywhere, and it's just going to be lame if it's so it's just that's that's life right there. I'm they're like, old, like old school, like, you know, old school, like Italians. You. I'm just like, yeah, we're going to get it, but it's going to be fucking boring and kind of lame and just like, you know, little pricks of each day that kill you, you know, that's my, my opinion on it.

  Matt Slayer As our corporate overlords get bigger. Yeah.

  Christoph Paul And that's what's happened. Yeah.

  Matt Slayer I'm really looking forward to see how Amazon cuts out their army.

  Christoph Paul I mean, it's going to be I think it's going to be like machines. I think it's going to be Terminator, you know, I think we're on our way there for that.

  Matt Slayer My, my whole theory on when it comes machines is like, they're not going to do it like in Terminator. They're not going be coming at us with laser weapons and no biological warfare.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, yeah.

  Matt Slayer Oh, hey, we you're my opponent has to breathe and I don't why would I fucking bother with nukes?

  Christoph Paul Yeah, no, it it's scary to think about. It's scary to think about with machines, but, I mean, I don't know, it's like, you know, I'm already like, I'm, I'm charging my phone, and there's that part of me is like, oh, where's my phone? It's not here, you know? So we're already the singularity is already happening.

  Matt Slayer One of the things I love about this medium is like, when was the last time we actually got to sit down, talk with someone for extend period? Time without staring at your fucking devices?

  Christoph Paul Beautiful thing. Now I'm, like, happy to do a podcast again. I it's been a long time, especially in person, you know, because we because I was in New York and he had, you know, fucking Cobain and all that shit, and it was just like, this is, this is dope. To just actually have a calm and more like, pretty much strangers.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. And we're all we have. We've exited like ten times, right?

  Matt Slayer That's it. I'm not. You're not even that saved on my phone like that level.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. I just like, we have each numbers, right? I haven't even put the name in so.

  Matt Slayer Yeah, there's no name, there's no picture.

  Christoph Paul But that's kind of great. I mean that's, that's the benefit of being in like the digital age, you know, you, you know, it's easy to set this up and I mean, I like it. I mean, I'm, you know, publisher and musician. So it's easier to do.

  Matt Slayer Oh, 100% need to have this level of recording technology even 15, 20 years ago would be fucking unheard of or prohibitively fucking expensive.

  Christoph Paul And everybody got a shot to do something, you know, and that's, that's, I don't know that, that to me is, is great, you know, it you need a little funds, but if you can get some funds, you can get some good gear and you know, anything can happen.

  Matt Slayer Hell, you don't even need good funds. Are definitely people doing this with their fucking iPhone.

  Christoph Paul That's true. That's true. So yeah, I mean like recording though, even with like going to music, do you like you can fucking do it on your computer now. I mean, I'm, I'm really lucky. My bandmate has a studio and that's why like I'm able to kind of wear these like basically do these two passions at the same time because that makes you waves year.

  Matt Slayer Oh, 100%. Yeah. I did some work in music in the mid 2000. Like walking us through your time was always the fucking worst.

  Christoph Paul It was. I did it. I had this band that totally bombed. It was about ten years ago, the only prescription, what's the name? And we did studio time and me and my bass player, we hated each other and she but she got a singing coach to be part of the recording studio and look, he's just kind of a very flamboyant theater guy and like I'm trying to sing this like love song, Rachel and he's like, she's in the bedroom.

  Christoph Paul So Rachel, what? You and it just fucks me up. It's it there probably in YouTube somewhere. It's like they're terrible. The recordings are awful. It was like the worst. And I'm like, I paid two grand to just I it was it was just devastating because that's, you know, it's not cheap like in you're so now I'm like, okay, let's take another take.

  Christoph Paul It's just it's like having steroids, basically. I have your own studio.

  Matt Slayer Yeah. It's just like, okay, so relax. Go have a drink, have a cigaret, whatever. You got.

  Christoph Paul Friends? I don't have a theater guy telling me to give her bedroom eyes or whatever, like, oh, man, it was a disaster.

  Matt Slayer And that's proof that a good producer versus a bad producer can make or break a fucking album.

  Christoph Paul Oh, yeah. I mean, no producers. I mean, I guess I'm biased being an editor because I feel like editors or producers of books. It's the same. Like, Sean's the producer, our guitar player, Sean shout out to Sean Quinn, and he was the producer, and he just. Oh, yeah, you should try it with this. Made it better. I mean, it's just, you know, makes me look so much better than I am, basically.

  Christoph Paul I mean, that's, that's what's great about having an awesome producer. Yeah, you're totally right.

  Matt Slayer And a bad one just, like.

  Christoph Paul Kills you. Yeah.

  Matt Slayer You don't even want to show up to the sessions.

  Christoph Paul You wonder, like, with some bands you hear a bad recording and you're like, Is this bad actually bad? Or is it the record? And you never really know. You know, you know, you know, if they play live and they're good, then that that fucking producer needs to to get a new.

  Matt Slayer Job or the other side of it when they do it in line with like, oh, they're fucking.

  Christoph Paul Horrible. No, know, that happens. That happens. We finally got to play shows we've played like literally played three. We like formed in 20, 20 during COVID, like a full band. We finally we've played like three shows now you know, and it's like we were actually good for two of the two out of three. The first one was just you got to get the first one out of the way.

  Matt Slayer 100

  Christoph Paul Percent. It was just like, all right, let's, that's the time to have a horrible show your first two new bands listening this new resistance let your first show really fucking stop do everything wrong videotape it and then go, okay, what, what do I have to fix and just be brutally honest. Then after that, we're like, Oh, okay, we're actually pretty good live.

  Christoph Paul All right? We're not just a good studio band, you know? And that helped.

  Matt Slayer And don't invite the friends and family out for the first.

  Christoph Paul No, no, it's it's just not the first three on. I honestly, the first five, you know, I've the other bands, I've done it, but, you know, practice a lot, and it's just that basement. If you have that I mean, I'm lucky I have a basement. That's because my best friend.

  Matt Slayer You have a basement in New York.

  Christoph Paul New York, where I'm in upstate.

  Matt Slayer Oh, okay. Okay.

  Christoph Paul I'm in upstate New York. Which is cheap. And honestly, like, I lived in New York City for a little bit. I have to say, I am fucking team L.A. all the way. Fuck New York City. Look, look, I loved it there, but I lived there for four years. But it's just not worth it. You know, upstate I have a yard.

  Christoph Paul I have a fucking yard, man, in, like, a basement. It's a it's like I have a cheap house. Like, it's just. I mean, I live in this town called Troy, which is just like a mini Brooklyn, you know, and, you know, just the hipsters have not found it yet, so I'm like, I'm like, baby, I'm the first hipster or whatever, you know, that's fine with.

  Matt Slayer The hipster of hipsters and.

  Christoph Paul The hipster of hipsters. I'll wear that title proudly. But, you know, it's nice. I love, love to Troy. But yeah, no, I mean, it's it's living in upstate made it so much easier to, like, start a business with a press you know, like, just save so much money. And I have all my friends in New York City, and they're like, they're probably making more than I do and, you know, and do it, you know, I have good freelance hours and they're living paycheck to paycheck.

  Christoph Paul But it depends like I, you know, at the same time, you have a lot more shit happening in New York City. Same with here. You know, it depends what you need. I mean, as a writer, it would be better to be in New York City, but as a publisher, I'm fine, you know? So.

  Matt Slayer Yeah, they have to submit to you. So yeah.

  Christoph Paul So it works. And we go down there, we're actually going to be down there in May 3rd doing a reading. So it's like a two and a half hour drive.

  Matt Slayer Oh, that's not bad at all. Not bad at all. Like being in places like New York or L.A. is like, you want to be here for the action, the networking, like the opportunities. But if you're already got a set base and don't have to be in these places.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, yeah. It's a weird thing to go from. Like, it's weird like as a press. Like, it's funny because like as the press, I feel like solidified. We're doing good. Like we're going to we're going to publish fucking IPv6, the heart in the Blender Guy. We're like publishing his memoir. We have a lot of good authors, you know, Michael Salinger, we were we were talking about him earlier before the show.

  Christoph Paul Very blessed, man. Like, I'm really lucky to have, like, a day job that I love that actually pays the mortgage. You know, I do freelance and and stuff, you know, but as a musician, I'm totally new. So it's like it's interesting to have one thing which is like solidified and another thing where you're you're you're just trying to get it rolling.

  Christoph Paul You know.

  Matt Slayer Where do you find time of the day to do both?

  Christoph Paul You know, I do the I do the publishing stuff in the day, and then I do music stuff at night. And I'll you know, that's kind of how it is. And I try to, like, find time, you know, with with the woman. With the lady. Oh, with the lady. And, you know, I do. I find it, but I'm tired all the time and I have to stop.

  Christoph Paul Like, I tweet about being tired and like, that's probably not good to do. You know, as you're trying to build yourself up as like a cool rock guy in just I'm fucking tired today. Yeah, I got to stop doing it.

  Matt Slayer Just fucking throw because you're just like, well, I just want to be sincere with my audience. And then it's like, no one really wants the sister right.

  Christoph Paul Now, you know? I'm kind of like, just hoping people start thinking I'm on heroin. I know that's bad. For a publisher, but you could be a publisher on heroin. Like, you know, I'm just like, it would be better than just. Yeah, I'm editing books all day and dealing with bullshit because we, like, joined a distributor here, and it's like, there's so much lame ass boring shit that comes with being a publisher.

  Christoph Paul Like, the book stuff is cool, like editing books, curating. That's, that's awesome. Then you're like, Okay, I got to figure out what print run to do. I have to do royalties. I have to email this person for a millionth time about publicity. It's like, that's the boring shit but it's pretty dope, though, you know?

  Matt Slayer So many people don't realize the business that goes into, like, anything fucking creative, like hell doing music. It's like, Oh, at some point you're gonna be like, I have to do inventory for merch. Fucking any physical media. You press all that fun shit. No.

  Christoph Paul And you know, it's funny because I have to deal all that shit with, you know, being a publisher. Like, I'm here because I did the L.A. Times Book Festival, you know, I'm wearing the, the publisher hat way more than the musician hat while in L.A. and you know, I got, you know, deal with the books. Actually, my friends played a prank on me that we got all our books stolen, like writers.

  Christoph Paul I was like and I was, you know, I'm run down because I was like, you know what fuck it. What? I literally was like, f fuck it. What are you going to do? They stole books. It sucks. But like, now we're just playing a prank on you.

  Matt Slayer But they're so disappointed by their reaction.

  Christoph Paul You know? Yeah. They're like, I have, like, these two, like, edgy writers that 11 I published and ones like her boy toy or whatever. And the boy toy like is the naughty one. And he's like, Yeah, let's play a prank on Christoph that we that the books got stolen. And I was like, Fucking, what are you going to do?

  Matt Slayer I guess we're making an insurance claim.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, yeah. You know, I'm like the lay man. I should've, should've left those out right there.

  Matt Slayer Part of a homeless encampment. Now.

  Christoph Paul I was like, fucking. Yeah, I mean, that's you know, people want to steal books. Like, they don't. People don't steal books. There's part of me that, like, subconsciously knew, like, now people steal music, people steal food. Stereo, rare people steal books. I wish people would steal books.

  Matt Slayer I love you. That's free marketing.

  Christoph Paul Fuck it. No. Yeah, I just would look at. I'm like, all right, that's our marketing. For the for the week. All right, move on.

  Matt Slayer There's just copies out in circulation.

  Christoph Paul But. Yeah, I know. It's cool. We did it. We did a reading and stuff, and I did the book. First of all, it was cool. I got to got to meet David Duchovny. That was kind of that was kind of dope, you know, God go. I know him from.

  Matt Slayer Playing Hank Moody, or.

  Christoph Paul He might as well have been because he's a writer, you know? But it's like I go way back to David Duchovny, you know, like, I can remember her being a 12 year old boy, and I know that I knew him. I can't remember. Did I know him through X-Files first? Ah, through scrambled porn. Because I can.

  Matt Slayer Read through.

  Christoph Paul Diaries. Read through diaries. I mean, I'm.

  Matt Slayer An old man. I know.

  Christoph Paul Okay. Yeah. So I was like, I'm like, an elder millennial. So I think I was just on the course. I might have been, like, even I might have even been pre puberty, honestly. So I might not even whacked it to read you Dyer's. It's I'm trying to remember here. I remember there was one that was my go to was like the bordello or something.

  Christoph Paul There was like, you know, I'm just women's stories of passion. I'm a male feminist, probably because of women's stories. Was you know, that was like it was like boring ass, you know, scrambled porn. I'm like, this is kind of fucking boring where but there's boobs, all right, you know, so I remember that one, but yeah, that's like an elder millennial and Gen Xers, like, four.

  Christoph Paul Definitely the dude. There was a time of scrambled porn.

  Matt Slayer Yeah. The children today will never understand.

  Christoph Paul Never get it. There's, like, I go on Twitter and I'll see, like, fuckin butthole pics, like, people are showing there, but, like, I'm not a prude. All right, pussy pics. All right, fine. That's a vagina, you know? Okay, look, that makes babies. Okay? I think where my line, it's like butthole. That needs to be something intimate, like, does it?

  Christoph Paul Cause I would say, like, that's like you've been dating, you know.

  Matt Slayer You've never had anal sex on the first date.

  Christoph Paul Not on the first day. You know, I think, like, the close oh, yeah. No, I dated this. She was a MILF. She was the first milf I ever hooked up with. I was 20 and she was 26.

  Matt Slayer And I oh, she's a MILF by, like, porn standards of MILF. Okay.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, well, she had a, she just had like she's like had a six month old, a nine month old. So she was technically the technical MILF she might have been 28. I don't know. I know, I just, I turned 20 and we hung out and it was like right around my birthday and, and we're, we're like, I mean it was just like it was a good match because she's just like, she got her sex drive back after having a kid.

  Christoph Paul I'm horny as hell is a 20 year old, you know I've had sex, but it's like you know, it's like this is a woman. This is not just another college or my high school girlfriend. And it was just a great match. And I remember like we've just done everything and it's like, hey, let's, let's try anal, you know?

  Christoph Paul And she's like, do you have lube? And I go, I have shampoo. This hour. Like, I didn't, I, I didn't know shit about anal sex.

  Matt Slayer I mean, it's funny. I didn't know shit about either.

  Christoph Paul I did not know a damn thing. I was just like, I did not know you immediately lube. I mean, I was just not I didn't not I know I knew about sex. I didn't. I know about anal. I'm just like, let's just try everything. And no, she didn't. She didn't. She did not want to have shampoo, anal sex to go figure.

  Christoph Paul I mean, isn't that period prude perfect.

  Matt Slayer And crude don't want no, it's it's Johnson justice. No more tears. Come on.

  Christoph Paul I think that was like the first time I knew I learned that it does help if you actually have like a connection with somebody else, I'll never forget we actually have to like we actually go get dinner. So we were like actually going to have a conversation that doesn't we just have like great sex and it's just like, then I'll never forget.

  Christoph Paul So this is like two I don't even know when this was. It might have been 2006 2000. I lost track. But she's like, so what about this war? Man? And I just thought that way. She said that she doesn't know. It was just like, we have nothing going on. We have nothing in common. We just like, you know, so we we lasted about three dates and we still never had anal sex.

  Matt Slayer So that's a goddamn bummer.

  Christoph Paul I know, I know. That's why you got two young guys. Have lube, have lube, old guys.

  Matt Slayer Everyone have lube.

  Christoph Paul Who don't use shampoo. Have lube.

  Matt Slayer That's my conditioner. Doesn't work either. What's that? Conditioner does not work.

  Christoph Paul Now, no head and shoulders. Not good for anal sex.

  Matt Slayer No, no, no.

  Christoph Paul Oh.

  Matt Slayer That sounds like unpleasant for everyone involved.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it'll keep dandruff away, but, you know, I'd.

  Matt Slayer Be a little worried if there's dandruff unreviewable like if your pubes are flaking on me, I might be out in the.

  Christoph Paul First place. Yeah. Yeah, that's not. That's not good. That's not good.

  Matt Slayer That would be horrifying. And I've done some horrifying things, but that might be my limit, I think, without my limit, folks.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. Yeah. I'm just, like, funny, because I forget I'm like a serious publisher. I always imagine like Kristof, Paul demands girls to have had installed their anal sex on Reddit or some, like, literary blog. I'm going to get canceled. Out.

  Matt Slayer Hey, God willing.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, yeah. Hey, head and shoulders. You want sponsorship? Christophe, Paul, Twitter. Instagram denies this effect. All I'm giving you. I'm giving you gold here. I head and shoulders.

  Matt Slayer The way I look at is the public has to give a fuck about you to cancel you.

  Christoph Paul So, yeah, yeah, not probably there yet. So that's good to sign, though.

  Matt Slayer The best will be in ten years when they go back and listen to this interview, then they come know.

  Christoph Paul That's going to be it's going to be like Christophe Paul multi multi-platinum artists. Oh, but wait. Did you know what he like to do with head and Shoulders Shampoo to a poor single mother?

  Matt Slayer Right. He only took her out for three days and he was out when there was no anal no anal sex.

  Christoph Paul Didn't like her stance on the war. I don't remember which fucking war it was. Could have been. It's probably, probably Afghanistan.

  Matt Slayer I mean, at that point it's like dual. I, I guess this time. At that point.

  Christoph Paul Who knows?

  Matt Slayer Who knows the Middle Eastern problems?

  Christoph Paul Yeah, the Middle East, so. Oh, man, I'm going to have a sip after that.

  Matt Slayer But it's okay. It's okay to spend time was on that. Know, the only thing that you have in common is running journals together.

  Christoph Paul That's okay. Yeah. No, that's the senior 20th. That's the time to do it. You know, I'm in a relation like committed. I'm married, you know, I'm in that now.

  Matt Slayer But how long you been married now?

  Christoph Paul We live in there like three years, but we've been together for like seven, so yeah, we're, we're in it for the long haul, but I miss her. Looking forward to getting back. But, yeah.

  Matt Slayer Sometimes all the turmoil sucks when you get home to celebrate.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, she knows what I like. She she's got all.

  Matt Slayer The has got fresh bottle waiting. She's got to crack the seal for you, baby. It's my.

  Christoph Paul Girl. That's my girl. Head and shoulders all the way. But yeah.

  Matt Slayer It's amazing, like, how much you'll put up with this dude. Like, oh, sex is good. And then, you know, oh, god, you talk.

  Christoph Paul Fuck. Oh, no. Yeah.

  Matt Slayer Well, maybe I'll hit it a couple more times. Maybe.

  Christoph Paul Maybe. Yeah. No, guys there we're awful. We'll just, like, we'll stay with it, you know? We'll stay with it until something. The only reason why wasn't with her is just because I met. I met this girl at Denny's at all places. I, I totally. I've met Mike. She was my crush because I would go there. I'm a writer, too.

  Christoph Paul I'm more of a publisher, but I would like to go to Denny's and. Right. And there was this, like, mysterious girl at Denny's. She was the Denny's girl. And I was just like. And I was with the with, you know, the MILF the young MILF, and then, like, the Denny's girl, me talk finally the mysterious, like, Denny's grocers go therein and draw.

  Christoph Paul So she an artist so that made it hotter and all that of being crazy. But we went out for like four months.

  Matt Slayer But yeah, the crazy ones are fun.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, she was she was fun. It was a great three yeah. It's like three dates and it was three months, you know, I was easing my way, you know, now I'm married and all that shit.

  Matt Slayer So that is another thing that I don't think millennials will ever get to like the Gen Z or the younger millennials will have really get to experience. Just going to a done is to hang out.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, that's more elder millennials and Gen X for sure. I mean, it was yeah. I would go like right at Denny's. It was like my spot, like I'd work on books and stuff there. Yeah, man. Denny's, Denny's, I guess it's you know, I did see what was that? There was that band like, what the fuck's up? Denny's. Do you remember that?

  Matt Slayer Yeah, that hardcore band. Yeah, yeah.

  Christoph Paul The hardcore band. So there's still there's still magic at Denny's but that's not the same.

  Matt Slayer I know my elder like it was either IHOP or Done is like open to a cigaret smoker at the time.

  Christoph Paul Like, yeah, hang out.

  Matt Slayer Smoked Cigarets for hours barely afford a cup of coffee and surprised it was it was some hot, some poor fucking spot for artists.

  Christoph Paul It's like, you know, it's like you have like you pitched your fucking all these like 1920s Perris and famous Fox like you know Hemingway and Fitzgerald that are fucking hanging out in these like fancy French cafes and you have these millennial and Gen-X writers in fucking Denny's and that says it all right. They're like, we got the raw deal.

  Matt Slayer I honestly feel like those guys, their friends cafe's probably romanticize their past shithole from.

  Christoph Paul Probably shitholes yeah, you're right. You're right. No, it probably fucking smelled like shit. And they're like, you know, the drinks are fucking awful and, you know.

  Matt Slayer But that's all fucking amazing.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, you're in Paris though, you know? Yeah, I would take that. I would take that over Denny's. No disrespect to Denny's. Denny's is magical place, but, you know, a moons over Miami or like, you know, a Parisian cafe in the twenties with probably. Probably prison cafe.

  Matt Slayer Yeah, probably.

  Christoph Paul But we'll never know.

  Matt Slayer We'll never know. And we don't get to live. We don't get to live that life's.

  Christoph Paul Not the same now. Denny's it's just not the same. I went, you know, I remember going again when the pandemic, like, started to let go. And I'm like, no, I just wanted like, I got to experience Denny's again. I was going to go, like, do my own writing there. And the ads, it's not doesn't have the magic. You know, there's a there is a romanticism to Denny's.

  Matt Slayer Well, there's not a bunch of teenagers in there smoking cigarets.

  Christoph Paul Or smoking.

  Matt Slayer Cloves.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, that's real. God, you're taking me back, man. Yeah, that that was. Yeah, that was that was a time. That was a time you could smoke at Denny's. Wow.

  Matt Slayer I was just.

  Christoph Paul Like, whole, whole.

  Matt Slayer Fucking groups of a sitting in the smoking section. Yeah, there was a Denny's out in a suburb.

  Christoph Paul Just, just old enough to remember that. So.

  Matt Slayer Yeah, there's a Denny's out in the suburbs in the suburbs of Chicago that my friends lovingly refer to as the same Denny's.

  Christoph Paul Mm. Like, that was the that's the artistic scene of the suburbs, really. Denny's. There's no, like, cool cafes. I mean, those are popped up more now. You know, that's another thing, too, because I and it's interesting because I know, you know, today's a special day on Twitter. I'm thinking about that. Like, you know, like you had like Denny's and you have maybe like if you lived in like in the suburbs, Denny's and like an open mike and that would be like your artistic.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, that was it. You'd have some you get shitty poetry, mediocre comedy and you know, maybe, maybe if you're lucky, a decent singer songwriter who you know, but they usually they are bad.

  Matt Slayer Yeah. Usually they're like, got an acoustic thing. Like, this is going to be horrible.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. So you just had a lot of bad art, but people came together and I think like, I think social media has actually replaced that. I have a whole thing where, you know, like, Twitter, you see a whole weird because I'm like, pa, all these different worlds, you know, I'm part of music, I'm part of writing. I love a lot of comedians.

  Christoph Paul And they're all like kind of fighting now because they don't have to put up with each other at the open mic. They all have to tolerate each other. Like the really the ultra woke poets had to deal with, like the edge large comedians and the, you know, the musicians who literally are just narcissists who don't care about anything about their own music, had to learn to be nice and have social skills.

  Christoph Paul And now, you know, you're just online promoting your own shit. And then the poets just now, they don't have to deal with the comedians. And the comedians don't have to deal with the poets. I know they're happy about that. And so you have these worlds that are not cross-pollinating any world, and I think it's actually part of why Twitter and social media sucks because, you know, there is something good about people who naturally wouldn't like each other having to be forced together and learn from each other.

  Christoph Paul And you don't have that with social to me. You don't have to do an open mic. You can fucking go on Tick-Tock, you can go on YouTube, you can you don't have to deal with artists you wouldn't want to deal with. And it's kind of shitty now.

  Matt Slayer I wholeheartedly agree. And well, one of the other things that's socially distanced is there are no fucking tastemakers anymore, for better or for worse or worse. I'm drinking.

  Christoph Paul Yeah.

  Matt Slayer For better or worse, the gatekeepers and tastemakers helped in some degree.

  Christoph Paul I do miss them. It's tough. I mean, you know, I went from like putting shit on hold as a musician and like I said, I stopped for a while. I stopped like in 20, 15. I kept writing, but I was like, I'm this band. Shit's killing me. I just took a break from it. I'm like, I'm going to switch.

  Christoph Paul And I started Switch Industries and went over to base. I was still a singer, but I was like, I'm going to go back to base. Am you know? Now I'm like, We've got an album coming out and it's a whole new world, though. It's like, you know, you had streaming in 20, 15, 20, 14, but it's different there was no Spotify.

  Christoph Paul When I stop, like 20, 15 is kind of the first time Spotify now it's all about Spotify and it's just playlists and you have tastemakers but it's, it's not the same.

  Matt Slayer It's not the same. It's not like before Radio one completely corporate where you'd have some fuckin program manager being like, I really dig your track I'm going to fucking school.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. I mean, there's some good shit that's missed, you know, you have some guy like I like the, the melon guy on YouTube, what's his name? You know what I'm talking about? He's just known as Melon. He's like the bald vegan guy. I like the guy. I'm not trying to shit on him. Gone above, and he's a cool dude.

  Christoph Paul His name is escaping me. But, you know, you have some people on YouTube that do that, but it's just not it's not the same. You know, it's harder when it comes down to a playlist. Like, we have our first single. We got lucky because we got enough fucking workout playlists, which is so funny. It's like we didn't get on the radio.

  Christoph Paul We got on a workout playlist, so we know we're going to reach like normies who like, want to like get up beat to fucking workout. And that's great. Like, I'm happy, but it's like, that's such a weird thing. Then like, we got on the radio ah, we, you know, it's just a different, different thing for musicians now, you know, I mean, it is what it is though.

  Christoph Paul I'm a realist. I'm very much like, All right, this is the way it goes. Let's, let's make it work.

  Matt Slayer Oh, yeah. No, I'm just an old man, like, reminiscing about the days of like, oh, hey, if you have talent and someone put you on versus like, oh, I have to be so good that I fuckin stand out from the noise these days, because that's really where you're at.

  Christoph Paul And it's interesting, like doing the Daryl song, you know, you're like, How do you promote it? Like, we've tried like, okay, let's use the publisher angle, maybe having fun and that actually just made things harder because it's just like people's attention span. So we decided we went from like, Oh yeah, it's a publishing, it's a book, not rock song.

  Christoph Paul About Cuckold. Oh, okay. That's interesting. Let me check that out. You have to just totally just totally pander to that like a short attention span. Then it's just how it is.

  Matt Slayer What, on Amazon? I mean, there's a reason that took up TikTok tock taken off and that both YouTube and Instagram are completely and embraced in short form shit right now. Yeah.

  Christoph Paul You know, I mean, in songs, I mean, like, you know, these like virtuoso musicians, like, I don't know me and like, I don't know if you can do a five minute and a half, you know, song anymore. I don't know if audiences are going to, like, stick around for a minute. Intro. I just don't know who like, I want that, you know, I'm, I'm like, let's play three and a half minute songs.

  Christoph Paul I'm all right. I'm going to be fine. But, you know, really serious musicians, it's like I don't know, man. Like, I don't know, you know, I don't know if people under 30 are going to, like, stick around to like feel that 45 second guitar intro I don't know.

  Matt Slayer So my favorite albums are like eight to ten minute fucking songs.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. You know, and that's the difference between kind of like gender. And it's interesting because like, we actually get a lot of Gen-X like, like Darryl's their grunge, it's their nineties, you know, guy who set up to show Robert, Robert Dean, like he's, you know, he's, he's Gen-X doo and he's like, fuck, yeah. This is like, I mean, I love nineties in 2000 years, you know, as a millennial, like, I love that shit, but it's like, you know, it's tough.

  Christoph Paul Like, if you go back to the eighties, I don't know, you know, I don't know if you can go that far.

  Matt Slayer Well and you don't want to go that far. It it was the most homogenized decade of music.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. I mean, I'm not a big fan of the eighties. Yeah.

  Matt Slayer I do actually have a soft spot for eighties pop, but it's pure nostalgia.

  Christoph Paul Yeah.

  Matt Slayer I have a sister who's ten years older than me who's her ideal baby to be in front of 80 some TV.

  Christoph Paul I mean, I definitely am a millennial in that way. Like, I rather listen to the fucking. I'm like, 80 said. I'm like, Oh, I'm just going to give you know, there's some sense this is good, you know, for me, like, you know, but I like, I mean, I like some Depeche Mode, some jarring. I like some of that kind of the here I can get into like the kind of Goth eighties that's like it for me.

  Matt Slayer A lot of the stuff wave stuff is a lot of fun. A lot of the what like, you know, the new wave the British new new.

  Christoph Paul Wave was cool. I mean, I have actually a weird soft spot for like Motley Crue. I don't know why I can't logically say why. Like, I think it's just they're fun. He's a good drummer, great guitar player. You know, Vince is whatever as a vocalist, but I mean, as a good vocalist, you just, you know, I love Mick.

  Christoph Paul I love the bass not Mick. Nikki Sixx is bass. I just got love for that dude. But yeah.

  Matt Slayer All right. And what other drummer can steer a boat with his cock?

  Christoph Paul Yeah. Did you watch that? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. That was a no, no, not. I mean, yeah, of course you watch the porn. I mean, did you watch the recent TV?

  Matt Slayer I did not. Is on the board.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. You know, it was fine. It was fine. You know, I, you know, nothing special where.

  Matt Slayer I don't think the youngins will understand, like, how much Pamela Anderson meant to everyone back in the day.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, I wasn't ever actually that huge into Pamela, but I get it. I get it. You know, I'm not a huge like, I'm an ass guy, not a tech guy. So, you know, it was just in the war of tits versus I am. I'm I'm an ass. So I never was, like, crazy about Pamela. I got it. She's beautiful.

  Christoph Paul But it was just never was like, oh, this is going to be a spiritual experience to see her have sex with Tommy Lee. It's just it was.

  Matt Slayer It really wasn't.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. It was just like it was, you know, and and it was like the first, like, kind of what would be the post-modern moment, you know? You're like, this is in porn, actually, this is something totally else. Like an intimate moment with two human beings. You know, it's just not, you know, let me come on your tits kind of thing, right?

  Matt Slayer And she honestly, it because it was intimate moments. She didn't look like she was a ton of fun in the sack.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. She's like, I'm they're like making love and.

  Matt Slayer They're making love and, well, you know, the canal is only so large and so you can steer a fucking boat with it.

  Christoph Paul So no, that's that's I get it. You know.

  Matt Slayer I mean, I know some people that are definitely into having their service, their cervix bruised when they have sex, but that's what everybody.

  Christoph Paul Know now that you got to get really lubes up for that. So do their own tweets around.

  Matt Slayer Yeah, I'm not knocking if they're into it, but.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, no, it's, it's, you know, sex is a fascinating interesting thing.

  Matt Slayer And we all got her from it.

  Christoph Paul We did. We really did. You know, we always, we always forget that, you know, we think of sex is just like the plaster but it is really it's about, you know, the reproduction and the eggs and the sperm and all that good shit.

  Matt Slayer Huh? Terrifying. Yeah.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. Not a fan.

  Matt Slayer I plan to procreate.

  Christoph Paul No, no. Now I have. Oh, I let it out. I'm like, oh, shit, I shouldn't be saying that. But yeah, no, I procreate, and I like, you know, I'm just 11 for me, and that's it.

  Matt Slayer What made you decide that you want to procreate?

  Christoph Paul I want to do it more than I wanted to do it less, you know? And that was that was what it came down to. But I'm happy. Yeah. No, I'm like a newly father. I'm like, it's hard. You're like, it's funny. I'll be, like, posting, like, shit about, like, we did a cover of Get Low. So I'm like, here, here's this new song about fucking calm.

  Christoph Paul And then I'll have, like, oh, here's my adorable son. He's three months old, you know?

  Matt Slayer So it's 12 month old. Come, it's oh, yeah.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, exactly. So it's it's a tough branding you have to like as a musician and a writer and all that shit, you're like, I'm just like, fuck it, whatever. You know, let the let the music and you got to have a vibe. Like, I'll dress up for shows, but at the end of the day, you just, you know, you can only you got to just be yourself.

  Matt Slayer But it's a performance like, yeah, who you are on stage or when you're doing it in a creative capacity is completely different than who you are.

  Christoph Paul Gonna and perform it. Exactly. Yeah. You know, I just don't want to be dad rock. I don't want to get labeled.

  Matt Slayer I don't think talking about Cuckold in your song is going to get you labeled Dad right.

  Christoph Paul Now. Yeah, the the band's fans are interesting because we we had the first single which was like this beautiful, like, you know, ballad. It's like you to ask about soul mates and all this, and I'm like, All right, let's go with the old song now. And now we just. I feel bad for the first the fans. Like, it's girls like.

  Christoph Paul I have to say, it's interesting to see women love the star song. Like, this is about soul mates and all that and dudes. Like, I didn't like the star song, bro, but the fucking old song that slaps. And now we just put out a hardcover of Get Lo, a crunk front cover of Pablo for four 20. And my wife said the greatest thing ever.

  Christoph Paul She's like, this, I don't know how, but you made this derriere. And I was so proud of that.

  Matt Slayer That's because I wanted aggressive, I adlibbed.

  Christoph Paul I'm like, because there's like a breakdown, and I'm like, You're going to shake clit to this. And I just kept it. We kept it, it you kept it in. And then like, the ending is like, almost like skids, gay motherfucker, you know? And then it's what it has. And I'm a I'm a skeet. Skeet, skeet. Yeah, I'm a ski ski all over her.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. So we made it, like, already. We just basically turn the ending into big hockey, which is, you know, kind of pretty much, I think what the song was anyways.

  Matt Slayer Yeah, a little John was definitely that's.

  Christoph Paul Shot out to him for like getting hooking up with a license. I was worried because I'm like, you know, I mean, it was, we went through destruction and all that, but I'm like, we really took liberties with the song. You know, I have the line, it's Christophe in this bitch, not Little John or the Ying Yang and whoever it was, you know, I put my name in and I don't know why I use instead of ATL, I use Brooklyn, even though I'm not from Brooklyn, but I just fit in because it's funny, you know?

  Matt Slayer So so as little John heard it.

  Christoph Paul I don't know. I don't know if I have a feeling he just has some, you know, they have somebody managing that and they're just like, okay, another get lo cover cool will make 50 to 500 bucks off whatever. You know, they gave the permission, so they thank you, by the way. Thank you. Whoever handles Little John's business.

  Matt Slayer Well, have you some publishing money down the road? Bills on her. You go Littlejohn.

  Christoph Paul If you you know you everyone I work with a small press. I got your back I am working with with a with a musician though I should give a shout out to a max of six. We will be publishing the the memoir of of Max and Eve six.

  Matt Slayer I'm curious if you ever thought about putting out a coffee table book of just as tweets.

  Christoph Paul So richly. And that's what I was thinking about doing. That's like, let's go make money. This would be easy. No max messes. So once again, it all comes back to Darrell. So this journalists, her name is escaping me. She's a great journalist, but she put on Twitter, she put she showed the the the chapter, the Darrell chapter about why is there no cuckold, you know, songs, why are there no Cuckold rock songs and even sex you know, who's if you don't know he's like prolific on Twitter is like a whole new life on Twitter.

  Christoph Paul Saw that and he thought it was the funniest thing ever and he started talking about event horizon being cockles and I don't know if you remember that band.

  Matt Slayer Oh of.

  Christoph Paul Appearances everything you want everything you need but she's not me or.

  Matt Slayer Something I was looking at the Laurence Fishburne movie.

  Christoph Paul Wait, I totally just called. That's kind of fucking great. I just casually called this, like, lame as fuck rock band. One of the best sci fi horror movies ever. So that's kind of great.

  Matt Slayer I was like.

  Christoph Paul Okay, vertical, vertical. Or I said, it's the name, not a vendor nice. And which is an awesome movie. No disrespect. Vertical Horizon, your fellow musicians, I don't mean to shit on you, but, you know, it's just a little it's kind of a lame fucking song. And it definitely had like, cuckold energy, but so, you know, we're like, Hey, man, we'll send you a copy.

  Christoph Paul We got friendly with him and I actually listen to the new I'm not a fan of the old you six, to be honest. Like, I know popular, but I wasn't into pop punk. I like new metal, you know, you listen to my own music, it's grunge. And then I listened and I like indie rock, like I like The Dandy Warhols.

  Christoph Paul I like, you know, just good bands like that. And these six was fine, but I never was like, you know, I'm like, okay, the Blender song. It's catchy. What? It's not my thing. And then I go check out their new music, and I'm like, holy shit. Like, if I'll say this no bullshit. I think even six new music is fucking good.

  Christoph Paul I think it's legit good shit. It's like, what? I wanted to see the Dandy Warhols do after they kind of blew up, and I don't, you know, it's just they didn't capture that magic again like they did in the nineties and early 2000. I love you, Danny Warhols. I'm just. I'm just being honest. I'm a huge fan, and I'm like, I hear this song called, like, Black Nova by Eve Sex.

  Christoph Paul I'm like, This is fucking good, you know? And I told him, like, Hey, man, this is actually good. And we just started talking on Twitter, and I get a DM one day, like, Hey, man, I decided to write something and the best line ever, and that's when I knew I had to publish the sex book. It was the line about third eye blind guy talking about, Hey, I don't want these guys on stage.

  Christoph Paul I want girls with big tits talking we ought to have sex. And I was like, This is a moment in rock history. I need to be the editor of this. I need to publish this. If you gave me this taste like there's it's funny. There's like a rock documentary that I love called The Defiant Ones, which is with Jimmy, Ivan and Dr. Dre and Jimmy Ivan is like he's got to get Trent Reznor with Nine Inch Nails.

  Christoph Paul He's like, he's in another record contract. He's like, I'm finding a way to get Trent Reznor. He's the guy. And that's how I was with the Eve sex book, like. And I'm like, it's, you know, class is like known for publishing some serious lyrics. I'm like, Nope, I got the the six book, and I kept messaging him and I found out he got some co-writers because I think it was just it's really hard to write a book.

  Christoph Paul And when you're already in Iraq, then they found these awesome co-writers, and then I see them doing it, and I'm like, I emailed them like I was on a fucking mission to publish the Heart of Winter memoir. My poor writers are like, serious like we publish some, like, academics and literary people, and they're like, Why the fuck is my Pulitzer obsessed with sex?

  Christoph Paul But I was I was like, I got to publish this but yeah, we signed a contract. So either 20, 23 or 20, 24, There Will Be A Heart in a Blender memoir. But yeah, it's, it's cool. It's cool. Like, that's probably one of the fun parts of my day job. I joke that, yeah, my goal is to get to actually publish if sex is to get Steve Albini to produce my band.

  Christoph Paul And that's, that's really why I'm doing it.

  Matt Slayer But you're playing Chess five.

  Christoph Paul Chess Publishing six. He's friends with Steve Albini on Twitter he you know, I slept the six, the demo, the SIP, our songs from the Daryl song, and then he's going to give it to Albini. And that's how that's how the diagnosis affects take takes over rock. That's that's the plan. So blame it on us.

  Matt Slayer This is the fact that really blows up what happens to the press.

  Christoph Paul So I've thought about this because, you know, I'll be honest. I think we have a shot you know, we got some good rock songs and it'll come down to you and I'm keep it real. If there is a rock revival, like if all of a sudden ZOOMers and fucking millennials, they're like, Hey, we actually like rock music again.

  Christoph Paul We have a real shot to go somewhere. If that doesn't happen, who knows? You know, I think we'll play some good shows. We'll have fun, maybe make some money. Who knows? Maybe we like our. Then the goal is like like one of my favorite bands. They made it because shout out to them. I love band. I love the gay blades.

  Christoph Paul They're not really around anymore. They're on hiatus. They got into a fucking Taco Bell commercial, and I was like, Fuck, yeah, my boys are getting paid. They got that Taco Bell money. So it's like, that's kind of the goal for like the 21st. Like, if you started a band in 2020, you're like, Okay, guys, yeah, we want to have fans, we want to have, you know, groupies, all that shit.

  Christoph Paul We need a commercial.

  Matt Slayer How do we sell out?

  Christoph Paul Yeah, there's.

  Matt Slayer A lot of media.

  Christoph Paul It's not even a question of selling out. It's like How do we do it? There's not even like, Oh, we got to like, it's just, you know, like, how bad is the corporation that we want to work with? Like, you know, like Taco Bell? I can deal with that, you know?

  Matt Slayer Yeah, they don't necessarily, right? No, definitely.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. No, no, no. They're pretty bad. They're pretty. No, no, no. I've read up on that Nas there's a line. There's a line. You go.

  Matt Slayer What? Your line. What is the line?

  Christoph Paul That that might be it. Honestly, that might be it. Just like, are you harming people? Like, purposely and hiding it? That's probably my line. You know, but yeah, no, I would basically still edit because I it's kind of like weird. I've made this because I was more of a writer than a publisher. It was not like a dream of mine to be a publisher.

  Christoph Paul It was just like, Oh, I'm good at editing. I should mention this. And, you know, Robert, because that's part of my story. Not to get sidetracked, but.

  Matt Slayer Tends to happen on the show. Don't worry.

  Christoph Paul Mandy. Sandra, you probably don't know the name.

  Matt Slayer I do not.

  Christoph Paul So this is kind of how I stumbled into being a publisher. This was kind of after I was like, I whatever. I took a break from writing, took a break from it. I was actually studying to be a shrink, and it was a weird time. My life is about 2014. I took a break from music, took a total break.

  Christoph Paul I was just like, this isn't happening for me, you know? And that's all right. You know, I like talking to people. We're having a good conversation right now. I think I'd be a decent shrink. You know, I was sick of freelancing shitty books, like I was burnout. I remember getting this guy's fucking journals. He's like turning this into a book, and I'm like, I can't do this anymore.

  Christoph Paul You know? I was burnt out, so I was like, All right, I'm going to go back to school and figure it out, and we end up moving to New Hampshire. It was like I went from New York City to New Hampshire because I have really cheap ass place to stay.

  Matt Slayer Yeah, there's a reason for that. Yes. New Hampshire.

  Christoph Paul It's New Hampshire. No one wants to live there. I can I can talk some shit about New Hampshire later. They're not even worth talking shit about New Hampshire. Like, it's such a shitty place. Like it's not even worth shitting on.

  Matt Slayer My my one true New Hampshire experience was I had to go up there for work in like 2011 and was my mind was blown because I had to go in the fucking commercial kitchens and there were white people working in the kitchens. I'm like, this is hell on earth.

  Christoph Paul I'm not white in New Hampshire. I'm an Italian Jew, not white, I'm not white. They're, they're, I'm something else that they don't like. Like they're fucking racist, crazy people. New Hampshire. I don't give a shit I never forget. And these were the nice New Hampshire people. They gave me a ride to the train station and it was really cold and I thought, I can stay in the car.

  Christoph Paul And literally the first conversation is, so why don't you think Obama has his birth certificate like that kind of shit, like birther, you know, it's like, you know, and then they're talking about George. So it's just like that kind of shit. George Soros, you know?

  Matt Slayer And I'm so in for that track.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, I know. I want that. You know, I want my George Soros check, but yeah. So we're in New Hampshire. I'm studying for a shitty university online to get a master's degree in psychology. And I'm like, Okay, took a break from music, took, took a break from writing. I'm not freelancing anymore and I'm doing school. And, you know, it's kind of a weird existence.

  Christoph Paul I'm not miserable, but I'm not happy And my friend on Facebook posts this picture of Kirk Cameron with a crocodile rock. And this is why I'm an artist. The one the average person would look and go, Oh, that's stupid. He's ignorant. There's I have evolution's real where does my mind go? Has anybody ever written a book about Kirk Cameron having sex with a crocodile?

  Christoph Paul And that's where my brain went. And for the next few weeks, I was obsessed with the idea. I'm like, I think this is because there is this weird. So there is this weird genre you know? And I would follow genre trends. There was always was kind of a publisher, you know, I'd like always look at what's happening in literature.

  Christoph Paul And I met these girls, and this is before I did my break like I before, I was like, oh, whatever. I'm done with publishing. I'm done with everything. There is these girls that I interviewed them, I don't know what happened to them. I think they quit writing. They were prolific and they were dinosaur erotica writers. They fucking started the trend.

  Christoph Paul I don't know if you ever heard of Chuck Tingle. Yeah. So before Chuck Tingle and we'll get into Chuck Tingle in a minute because I think we have weird parallels, not me, but my pen name, who I'm getting to so I met these, you know, I was like I was a light bulb went off like they planted a seed and I was like, I want to interview these girls taken by the T-Rex.

  Christoph Paul I mean, it was just like it was just fucking girls, fucking dinosaurs. And I'm like, holy shit. Like, you can even do that. Like, it was just like I was kind of impressed and I interviewed them and I talked to them online. Like, I was the first one of the first people to interview them. I don't even know if that's online anymore.

  Christoph Paul It's like, 20, 13. I interviewed them but I was like, Holy shit. They're like, These are working. They're working their way through college writing dinosaur erotica, and I just thought that was so bad ass. So there, there's a seed planted, and then I ended up writing under a pen name for I like retired for a little bit or whatever I wrote.

  Christoph Paul Do you remember the the fetish about masking was about men dressing up in dolls. They would dress up as dolls.

  Matt Slayer I've never heard that one.

  Christoph Paul Actually, it's called masking. There was a documentary in Britain and it went viral. And one of my buddies, I've written some some books as a writer I wrote and one of my books was Great White House, which is a Shark Attack on the White House. It is ridiculous. It's I don't even I'm not going to say it was a good book, but it was funny.

  Christoph Paul You know.

  Matt Slayer That sounds like it should be a sci fi movie.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, I think it was based on let's rip off Sharknado and put a book out and have it be political satire. It was like, let's see if South. What happened was South Park wrote, you know that. So I did that. And, you know, I just kind of petered out but I wrote like this. I chose this man De Sandra, this pen name.

  Christoph Paul And I and I did this masking story called the Masquerade Ball in Diseases is like a fetish of dudes who like to dress up and be a living doll. So I and I was just like, this is so fucking weird. I'm going to write a story about it. I'll put it under a pen name so I don't ruin the writing career.

  Christoph Paul That was not happening really at the time. But I did that, and then I was like, the idea came to do the fucking Kirk Cameron and the Crocodile Act of Chaos Magic, and I had to write this and it, it was fucking wild. Jesus comes back he has stigmata. Kirk, Cameron, Fox, Jesus, the Saints. It was so just like it.

  Christoph Paul I just, like, did not give a fuck. I'm like, all right, my writing career is already done. I'm going to write this for myself and just do something like super transgressive, super ridiculous, and I'm going to put it out under Mandy Sanders can do this is a joke. Just to amuse myself.

  Matt Slayer I've got to know one thing. Did Jesus just head and shoulders on his.

  Christoph Paul He was made? I don't know why this happened. So Jesus was made out of cheese and hence he was He was Jesus I just, like, let my, like, fucking crazy, whatever you want to call it, take over the.

  Matt Slayer Drugs involved with this.

  Christoph Paul No. I was completely sober with this book, and then, like, I learned that the I remember. Did you ever watch Growing Pains? Of course. Okay. So, like, it was like, right on that line, you know, like I'm saying, the older millennial. So I vaguely remember it. And I, I did not know that the character who played bonus to Bone had passed away, and I was halfway done writing it and I'm like, oh, shit, that's shitty.

  Christoph Paul I don't, I don't want to, you know, be it's all about the ghost of boners, the bone contacts, Kirk, Cameron, G. I mean, it's just got y like this thing made no fucking sense, you know, Kirk is a crock. This guy name AJ or whatever, he jerks off on the photo of Kirk Cameron in a crock it up and he makes a chaos magic spell that creates a living crocodile.

  Christoph Paul I don't there is not logic in this story, but it was funny to me at the time. And all right. I should share this. My wife, she won't care because it's funny. So my wife is, like, really into new age, and I'm not I don't believe in ghosts. I don't believe in any of this nonsense. She believes in you know, we're not an opposite couple, but, like, she loves, like, you know, what is it called?

  Christoph Paul The bullshit. Your birth chart astrology.

  Matt Slayer Astrology.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. I'm like, this is bullshit.

  Matt Slayer I ask you, like, what? What time you were born and shit.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. I'm like, I don't fucking know. Who cares? You know, she's. But she's all into that and like, you know, she's pretty wild. She's. I love my wife, but she's wild as fuck and, like, she's calm down. She's a mother now. She's a publisher. She serious. But at the time, you know, she was into chaos, magic. And I'm like, this is bullshit, too.

  Christoph Paul And she said, you know, I'm I showed lewd pictures so men would could masturbate to do chaos, magic, smell. And I'm like, that's I was pissed. I was like, this is fucking stupid. Like, do something. Like, let's, let's do something. Like, New Hampshire made her insane, basically. So I know no disrespect to my wife. Like, I get it.

  Christoph Paul You know, looking back, I'm like, we were in New Hampshire. I probably would have done the same fucking thing looking back. And I would have. Yeah, let's have some dudes masturbate me and make a chaos magic spell.

  Matt Slayer And you're supposed to make money from that.

  Christoph Paul And I mean, that's what it's like. I'm like, at least make some money off this. She's like, No, that's not what it's about. It's chaos, magic. And I'm like, so I'm like, I'm going to make fun of my wife. I'm going to troll my own wife. With this stupid story one. So my wife, Kirk Cameron, and I'm just going to have fun with this.

  Christoph Paul And, you know, I finish it. It's ridiculous. I find this like cover this deviant of a crocodile with like a bow tie. And I just make this cover. I put it out. This is 2014. I want to say. Yeah, and sorry we a couple of days pass Wonkette or something. Like it. Then another media thing looks at this and another one and they all, like, jump on it like, like fucking vultures.

  Christoph Paul And this thing goes fucking viral. I make, like, a big sum of money writing this fucking it up book like a fucking moron. I actually like forgot to take my name out of it. So my name, Kristoff. Paul is in the book because I forgot it's not copy edited. I didn't edit it. I was like, Who cares?

  Matt Slayer You're a professional editor who's like my own content.

  Christoph Paul I'm like a fucking who cares? You know, who's going.

  Matt Slayer To read this?

  Christoph Paul I'm like, No one needs it. And like, I'm to be fair to myself, I was like, It'll make it more authentic that it has typos. And it worked in a weird, fucked up way that it did. So this thing goes viral, and I'm like, Holy shit, I just have a hit book. And then I'm like, I need to write more of these.

  Christoph Paul And, you know, it was a weird time, too. My mom passed away. She got she was very sick. So then and so I'm like, I go from basically being a broke loser in New Hampshire. So I get this like big chunk of money from the Crockett up book. My mom passes. So will I get some money from her?

  Christoph Paul I'm like, Holy shit. Like, I actually have a chance to do something, you know, and my mom passing like that affected me. I start cranking out these Mandy de Sondra books I did. Like, I did political erotic satire and this is before I even Tingle was doing them. And I look, I love Shock Tingle. I kind of pushed him.

  Christoph Paul Mandy did, not me. I want to say that I'm not Mandy. Mandy's her own thing, and that's a whole other story. I kind of see her as a whole other person. So I, you know, he sees the Crockett thing, and then I do. I do Rabbit by Reagan saw it's about Sarah Palin fucking or Reagan stories. Dinosaur. I mean, I just did a bunch of shit and I was I did even an erotic parody of a there's this literary novel called Only People in Publishing Know This, but I basically I just was a troll.

  Christoph Paul I was a literary troll. It was called City on Fire. This guy got paid $2 million to write this ridiculous 900 page book that nobody liked. So I do an erotic story about Reptilians and all this nonsense called City on Fire. I do the same cover and people in publishing were buying this book as a joke for each other because it was like, you know, I just knew kind of how to troll.

  Christoph Paul And I made some really good money being made and Sandra and I'm like, You know what? I like this. I like fucking publishing books. And, you know, I'm a good editor, you know, this kind of stuff is nonsense, but, you know, I'm liking, you know, coming up with covers, coming up with stupid ideas, figuring out ways to, like, market it to the media.

  Christoph Paul You know, I was like, Oh, okay, this is how the media works. Like, I saw once one of them bites, they all bite. So I learned, I learned a lot of skills, you know, and I was a decent business person with that. And also, this is what happened to I ended up getting in trouble as Manny de Sandra.

  Christoph Paul And this really pushed me to go toward publishing because I needed to find a new revenue stream. So there's an alt right guy who I troll named Marc Dice. Do you ever heard of him?

  Matt Slayer I feel like I've heard the name. I'm not really familiar.

  Christoph Paul So he's like he's he's like, all right, you know what I mean? Crazy conspiracy theorists like QAnon type nonsense, you know, like like, I don't care if I really don't care if you're left or I don't care, like, but there's, like, that line, you know, when you're going into creating when you're, like, making videos about Drake being a demon.

  Matt Slayer I know that's not true.

  Christoph Paul No, Drake, he's just a Canadian. He's a nice Canadian boy. But, yeah, it's to be fair.

  Matt Slayer Oh, man.

  Christoph Paul I be it's not a demon. Sorry. He's not an Illuminati. Jay-Z is not either.

  Matt Slayer Jay-Z owns the Mets. He might be that.

  Christoph Paul Actually, Jay-Z is. Yeah, Jay-Z's.

  Matt Slayer Come on, on. All right, so let me guess not. So let me come from you in this. How did Jay-Z get Beyonce if he's not in the Illuminati?

  Christoph Paul All right. Jay-Z is not a good, good example. He was on the Illuminati. He made a deal with Satan to get Beyonce. But I don't think Drake is that so do this fucking book called Marc Drake Hotline Bling. I the but it's a picture of Drake. Remember the stupid dance meme? It's that with this alt right guy shirtless getting the hotline bling by Drake.

  Christoph Paul And I just was, like, going crazy. I did not give a fuck. I'm just going to like, I'm going to throw all these motherfuckers. Like, I was getting high off the shit because I'm going from, like, a guy who really didn't have much success as a writer or musician to I'm making a living doing South Park erotica, basically.

  Christoph Paul And he contacts Amazon for libel basically who missed her free speech. Anything goes you know, which makes me kind of they're like, I think these guys are all full of shit. These like, I'm a free speech because I'm all I'm 100% free. It's after this. Like, I don't I don't think anything should get banned. I don't care. This really affected me.

  Christoph Paul But he was so like a dumb ass, though, thinking, okay, I should just take the book down I do another book, another book cover called The Illuminati, Mark, Dice K and Illuminati Stories or something. It's just something ridiculous. And I got banned. I got that book banned and I got all my paperback books taken down from Amazon. They left the Kindles which was good, but it was like, Oh, shit, all right, this is not good, because I was making some money on those paperbacks as just joke books.

  Christoph Paul People would buy it. I'm like, All right. You know, I was thinking about doing the press. This might be the time to switch gears because I'm kind of getting kind of insane doing this. And it's hard to compete with Chuck Tingle. You know, we're kind of like one upping each other, like and I remember like by the time he did the the pounded by the pound, and he and I was like trying to do a wall, werewolf, erotic, werewolf, gay, whatever in London, I don't know.

  Christoph Paul I was like, you know, I just can't keep doing this. I'm kind of I'm tired of being Mandy de Sandra. I'm a good editor. You know, I'd like to write something a little serious. I ended up having an agent at the time doing the Mandy, too. Sandra's stuff got her in doing the great White House. So, you know, I was like, all right, I'll kind of try to work on a Y, a novel, maybe something mainstream and try my hand in publishing and little by little, you know, we kind of found our way, but it was Marc Dice kind is kind of thanks, man.

  Christoph Paul You know, you're a fucking piece of shit, but you helped start this press that's topless, you know, all types of authors and cuckold books and, you know, thank you I, I would have probably just kept doing Mandy de Sandra books more and that would have fizzled out, you know, that would. It was, you know, that didn't have much of.

  Christoph Paul I mean, chuck props and chuckling. I have no anger or anything at Chuck Tingle. Like, I think he's the guy to do it. I'm glad he's he carried the mantle of Bizarro Erotica political bazaar he's amazing at it.

  Matt Slayer There's such a weird subgenre.

  Christoph Paul Like yeah and it's like it's really meant for like one person, maybe three, you know, and yeah, I had a good run, so I ended up doing a few more Mandy books, but they were like horror. I did one the Giants globalists or I did one, like making fun of the alt right called Social Justice Warrior Snuff Film.

  Christoph Paul So, you know, I was like, you know, I'm getting kind of worried about promoting these. I want to be taken a little more seriously. I am going to do one. You know what I'm going to I'm going to go because I was just like, you know, I've had a kid I'm there like I'm a I'm a serious publisher now.

  Christoph Paul And, you know, there's that side of you and you I'm a musician. There's that side of me, you know, that means to, like, fuck some shit up means to do something just weird and indulgent. So I am going to go back and do a Mandy. It's been like three years. I am going to do all announced it on here.

  Christoph Paul Do you remember the movie audition? It was a career, I believe it was Korean. It was a hardcore horror by Caché. My Mickey I'm saying his name right audition. It was about this guy. He pretends to have a you know what? I don't know if I should even say the title I should really surprise people, but it's going to be, oh.

  Matt Slayer No, I want to hear. I want to I want to hear the.

  Christoph Paul So I was like, all right. So the other book that she's working on is called Chumming, which is about a shark attack fetish. So I'm doing just like but I kind of got stopped with that and I hadn't felt inspired. I'm like, this is actually kind of a lot of work to write this, you know, basically crash with with sharks so I'm like, you know, this is actually a lot of work.

  Christoph Paul You know, by the time, like, the second act comes, I'm like, oh, man, this is going to take some serious crap. I don't have time to do this right now. So I thought of this movie audition, which is about this guy. He pretends to have like a movie audition to get a wife. And I have I do have, like, a certain type I really like and I will lay that out here.

  Christoph Paul I like Pogs fat ass white girls. I like fat ass. Any girls by the way? It doesn't have to be just.

  Matt Slayer For self-proclaimed ass man or. Yeah, I like I you're like, oh, I'll pass on Pamela Anderson, the ass man.

  Christoph Paul Like, yeah, the fact that ain't even like I'm this. I just like a good size ass. Let it out there. It's I know I say it on Twitter. I'm just I'm an ass man.

  Matt Slayer So what do you think a Brazilian butt lift started attempted it too much. But.

  Christoph Paul You know, I'm not into you know, and I talk in my first book, The Past in the Kristoff, I talked about this. You know, I'm not into any kind of ass. And I think it needs to be natural.

  Matt Slayer Well, not on impulse. It's a fat transfer.

  Christoph Paul I understand. But it's it's not the same. I don't know. I'm old school that way, you know, like I'm not.

  Matt Slayer So why aren't you guys done a cover, baby? Got back then.

  Christoph Paul You know, I just. I felt more inclined with Get Low, you know, I'm going Italians, you get low, and people who are like, oh, is that cultural appropriation? No, because Get Low is a bat mitzvah song now.

  Matt Slayer Is it really?

  Christoph Paul I think so. I think it's the official kind of bat mitzvah dance song now.

  Matt Slayer My my I guess technically the second cousin's bat mitzvahs in five days. I wonder if that's.

  Christoph Paul You're going to hear Get Low.

  Matt Slayer I'm not going to be there for I and find a struggle for a mitzvah.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. But you know, it's get low is like mainstream bat mitzvah wedding song. It's that song because they play the edited version, not the, you know.

  Matt Slayer Well, fuck that. Yeah. Is there a woman now you should be able to hear the censored version.

  Christoph Paul Bar mitzvah to you know, but.

  Matt Slayer You're man or woman, you've reached adulthood. You should build it.

  Christoph Paul That's a good point. I'm with you there and in spirit, you know. But, but so yeah. So I was like and I made a joke, and this is how book ideas come. I'm like, you know, I'm thinking about we have a new single we're going to be coming out called Don't You Tell Me and I joke, you know, like as a publisher, I'm like, oh, we need to connect with audiences.

  Christoph Paul We need to be serious. We touched people's souls. The reason, like I'm talking to the guy is I'm like, let's just get a hot dog to dance to the song. You know, that's, that's this isn't fucking rocket science. Let's just have a hot dog, you know, do it. Whatever.

  Matt Slayer So sex.

  Christoph Paul Sells. Yeah. I'm like, this is a sexy song.

  Matt Slayer It's like a fucking Whitesnake.

  Christoph Paul In the term. I'm like, I need to have a pop audition. And that term hit me. And all of a sudden, the book idea of audition about, you know, so basically I'm that's Mandy to Sandra. She is coming back to write the erotic hardcore horror novella Hog Audition.

  Matt Slayer Nice. Yeah, nice.

  Christoph Paul So that'll be fun. I don't know when that's going to come out. We'll see. I want to, like, take a little time to just write again, you know, doing a lot of polishing work. I'm doing a lot of musician work, but I want to just crank out like the old days of Mandy to Sandra and crank it out in a day or two and right cognition.

  Christoph Paul I started writing it on my phone actually, so I think I'm going to write it on my phone.

  Matt Slayer Right on your phone. Right on the plane. On the way.

  Christoph Paul Home. I actually did write it on the plane right here. I worked on Act one, so we'll see what happens we'll see what happens. So, yeah, you hear it. You heard it here.

  Matt Slayer I got the.

  Christoph Paul Scoop. Got the scoop. And yeah, we will actually have a probably much better art, but our, our third our third single, which will be I don't know when this appears, but it'll be probably mid-June. The Diana suspect will be put now to the third single, Don't You Tell Me, which will probably be better than politician, but who knows?

  Christoph Paul Who knows? You know, I mean, look, I I'm very proud of this song. I think it's a good like it's kind of like Spoon meets the Stooges. I'm very excited about the song. But POG, this man, you just don't know, you know? You just don't know.

  Matt Slayer I have suppose.

  Christoph Paul Next crocodile attack.

  Matt Slayer I don't have some parks I can refer you to if you want to actually do a politician for your actual fucking.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, we'll see. We'll see. You know, we we got limited time, so, you know, if we don't do a politician video, we don't do a party video. It's not the end of the world, you know the song.

  Matt Slayer But it could but it could be could be the end of the world.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, it could be you know, I mean, every man needs a good pog. That's that's my kind of words of wisdom for the day. I'll drink to that.

  Matt Slayer I wholeheartedly agree. So I know a handful of them. Yeah, I could definitely introduce you to someone, and I'm sure they'd love to be in a music video.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. Yeah, they just basically, I just want. I just want to hop hog to dance to this song. It's like a three minute, 30 minute song. That's it. I'm not trying to break boundaries or rules. I just want a hot dog looking good. So this this sexy rock song, that's all, you know, like my, you know, she's like a the publicist I work with, she's like, we need a music video.

  Christoph Paul I'm like, what's so the guy's like, let's get a hot dance to the song. Let's keep it simple.

  Matt Slayer Hey, we will talk off air. I will go, I'll break out. Like, I know this person, but I know some folks.

  Christoph Paul That.

  Matt Slayer If you're okay with having adult performers in your video, I know some folks.

  Christoph Paul That's the budget. That's that's the is all my money goes to the press. So but yeah, we'll talk after we'll talk.

  Matt Slayer I know some performers who might just do it for the funds is.

  Christoph Paul That's that's cool. Well, this is a conversation for after the show. Yeah I'm very excited to have they're excited to have. This is fun, man. No, I'm like I'm having a good time, you know, cause I've been like basically like I literally when you're doing a book festival, it's like, hey, how you doing? And you got to make eye contact.

  Christoph Paul You're Mr. Sales. Oh, you like that kind of book? Oh, that's great. Like, I'm just like a totally different person, so it's nice to not like be in that zone of just because that's what I've been doing. I've been at the LA Times Book Festival, a one man band. Basically, I got two suitcases of books. I'm selling books about cuckold partying, you know?

  Christoph Paul So yeah.

  Matt Slayer That's got to be just like whole serious the whole time. No, no, we're not. We're not about that. It we're about having some fun.

  Christoph Paul Yeah.

  Matt Slayer And but I'm curious, what do you look for in someone you want to publish? Like what? Oh, yeah. What kind of story you see?

  Christoph Paul Like, this is the shit I actually like. I don't like the bullshit, but I actually really I mean, I'm passionate about books, man. I mean, you really have. I heard a guy shout out to Johnny Temple. He did a nice panel, and he said the greatest thing I've ever heard about publishing. It's a stupid fucking business, but we love books.

  Christoph Paul Like, I have always loved to read, you know, editing fun in that, you know, in my own writing, it's stressful at times. You're like, oh, fuck, is this good enough? You know, we're editing. Basically, what I do is I go, there's a story working. It's like interactive reading. It's like video games. For a book. That's how I really look at editing.

  Christoph Paul So I like it. I actually am a weirdo who likes to edit books. If the band got big, basically what I would do is hire somebody to do all the fucking bullshit, and I'd still just curate and edit books. I could do it on the tour bus or like, I've thought about this, I just pay some fucking smoke.

  Christoph Paul Now they're not a smoke. They're a beautiful person who actually does that shit because that's just sucks. I hate it, but right now I'm the one doing it because my wife just had a kid. We run the press together. But anyway, so, so like, you know, I mentioned earlier with Darrell, for example, right away, that voice, it's all about the voice.

  Christoph Paul If I see this voice has something special and I can tell in the first line I've read, I've read probably how I want to say 7000 submissions. I mean, I really don't think I'm overexaggerating. I think it's somewhere it could be ten. I've lost track. I because we have open submissions for glass books. If you want to submit, you will get me to look at your book for at least 15 seconds and I will know in that first sentence, that first sentence is everything and I can tell right in that first sentence I can tell, does the person know their character to have they thought about this book has it has the, you know, the do they

  Christoph Paul know the right rhythm? Like I can just like I'm like, fucking rain man. When it comes to books, I don't know why it doesn't make sense. I don't think of myself as a very smart guy, but when it comes to like that first sentence, that first paragraph, I can just, like, see in the future, you know, it's a very weird thing.

  Christoph Paul I don't know why I can't logically explain why, but I can just tell and I'm right. Like, 95% of the time I make 98. I would say there's a 2% where I might be wrong, you know, but it's like, fuck it, I got other things to do, but it's the, the voice, the character, you know, just the character.

  Christoph Paul Grab me of the interesting, you know, it's, it's books are based basically hanging out with somebody. I mean, that's what they really are. You're hanging out with a fictional person. If it's nonfiction, you're kind of hearing their life story. You're going like, it's like, can I go on a fucking road trip with this person? That's kind of what it is?

  Christoph Paul You're like, Okay, it's going to be like two days of my life, you know, or whatever it is. However many hours do they have that cool voice? They have that story. I want to hear you know, they have a sense of rhythm where it doesn't, you know, it's not the same boring lines. You know, they have some personality.

  Christoph Paul It's tough, it's tough. To write a really good book. You know, that's that's the truth. Like, it's really hard to write a book that stands out from the pack. It's a hard thing. And you know, the truth is, though, you can actually writing is cool and that you can get better. It's actually a craft and skill where, you know, singing, playing music.

  Christoph Paul It's tougher, it's tougher, you know, like, you know, you can stick to your strengths. Like, I'm not I don't have a huge range, but I have a baritone that I like. I like where it's at, you know, so you learn, you know, what your strengths are and what your weaknesses is. But yeah, no, I mean, he's got really excite me, you know, you got to like bring me back to like being a kid and reading for the first time.

  Christoph Paul You really have to bring that feeling to me or really any editors are really serious for agents, all that shit. Like, you got to like, make us not be logical. Like, let's forget. I don't, I don't want to think about selling it, like, on my ass, you know, it's like, dominate me. It's kind of, you know, I'm like a club, you know, take me over that fuck up my day, basically, like, I have other shit to do.

  Christoph Paul Like, I reading your book is not that important to me. So make it that it is. You know, I think that's I mean, it's brutal, but it's like, you know, I'm on the other side of that, too. I'm a writer. I get it. You know, there are way everybody wants to write a book now. You know.

  Matt Slayer About this guy.

  Christoph Paul Nope, nope, nope. Didn't you write a book? I did. Oh, I don't know. I was like, I'm going.

  Matt Slayer You fuck. No, fuck, no.

  Christoph Paul Oh, I think I just saw, like, a blurb from Robert Dean just about the podcast probably. I know what bless you for not wanting to write a book. I like you even more. I already like you, but like the fact that you're not like, oh, I should write a book. I'm like.

  Matt Slayer There is a point in my life where I want to be a screenwriter.

  Christoph Paul That's cool, you know?

  Matt Slayer And I realized I don't have that in me either.

  Christoph Paul Hey, yeah, I know it takes a certain certain type to, like, write a book. Like, I'll give a shot out. Like, I had a meeting today with one of my writers, Autumn Christian, and she just has it, you know? She just has it. She is obsessed with, like, getting better. She wants to get better. She wrote a dope book called Girl Like a Bomb, which is about this girl who it's like a superhero sex story.

  Christoph Paul It's fucking great. Like about this girl. If you sleep with her, you have self-actualization. She made it classy, though. She made it literary. Beautiful. So you know what I mean? Like, and she she just wants to get better. And I think that's what a writer has. They're, like, more obsessed with being wanting to get better than being lights.

  Christoph Paul And that's that's what I look for, honestly. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.

  Matt Slayer I did my own screenwriting experience, like, the limited time I tried to do it, I could never get past, like, my first fucking act. It was just like, oh, no, I just got to keep revisiting it. Yeah.

  Christoph Paul And that's not a good no.

  Matt Slayer It's a horrible sign. Yeah. I have found later in life that I am much better at poking holes in other people's plots than I am at writing my own. Yeah, I am. Robert has bounced a lot of his stories off me over the years. Yeah. Whereas it's like, that makes no sense, man. Or maybe punch it up this way.

  Matt Slayer Like, I've helped him punch up shit. Like, yeah, but to actually fucking do it myself, then not my skills.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, no. I mean, I definitely would be the first to say I'm a better editor than writer. I did finish a book I'm really proud of. I'm going to look for an agent again. We'll see it was kind of like all the editors stuff, finding his way until, like, something I'm writing, but I don't have, like, the need.

  Christoph Paul Like, I don't know, music's taken over. Like, music really took over the last couple of years. You know, I'll probably write the occasional Mandy de Sandra nonsense, basically. But for me, music's like, my passion and polishing is my day job, you know, and yeah, I mean, writing's fun. I mean, you know, I can, but I like, I've seen, like, I've not really written much.

  Christoph Paul This lasts, like, nine months. I'm fine, but I'm writing. I'm writing songs, you know, and that's an energy needs to go. So I'm one of those guys where I need to be doing something creative or I get kind of nutty, you know.

  Matt Slayer And I feel that's healthy.

  Christoph Paul Like, yeah.

  Matt Slayer The people that I don't comprehend, the people who are just like, Yep, I'm going to go work in the car factory. I'm going to work here forever. I'm okay with this. I'm going to go home.

  Christoph Paul God bless those. I think.

  Matt Slayer Those. I mean, we need those people, but.

  Christoph Paul They're blessed, I think, in a weird way. But that would make me insane. Like, I've tried that, you know, I've did sales jobs. I mean, I ended up working for like the Department of Labor with that was a great job for a little bit because I could just, like, not do shit and. Right. And get paid by the government for it.

  Christoph Paul But I got fired two years later, you know, it's.

  Matt Slayer Like two to two years. It's two.

  Christoph Paul Years. No, I had like a good two years to like, do shit that I wanted to do, you know, basically getting paid to write on the government's dime. I was, I was happy with that. So, you know, yeah. Writer jobs are weird, you know, the porn star. I mean, that was a great writer job. I fucking could read like I read fucking Anna Karenina at the porn store and I had like talks with the Purves about it.

  Christoph Paul I'll never and I wrote about like it was like, who's this Anna Karenina bitch? I'll never forget. Somebody asked him, like, does she love the D? And I'm like, That's the problem. The story, man. You know? And I have like, I have basically a porn star book club about Anna Karenina. And that was that was a beautiful moment my life.

  Matt Slayer So how did you end up with the porn star?

  Christoph Paul So my girlfriend at the time, we're in Orlando, we graduated, you know, we're both like we went to UCF, shout out to UCF in Orlando. And she got like a job working at the Spy Museum. And I just wanted to get the fuck out of Florida. I was like, all right, I'm a writer and musician. I want to do something with that.

  Christoph Paul That's not happening in Disneyland. That's, you know, I'm not going to work for Disney, so I need to get the fuck out of here. And so do you see it's not New York, but it was like oh, it's something, you know, so and I needed a job right away, and I'm like, all right, fuck, you know? I mean.

  Matt Slayer This is just Hollywood for ugly people.

  Christoph Paul It is. It is. So I was like, all right, you know, we'll figure this out. And I saw an ad for a video store. I'm like, oh, hell, yeah. You know, it's like a dream job. I can do a video store. I'm this. I mean, I'm surprised that a video store is still around. You know, this is like 20, ten, maybe 20 not, I don't know, like 20, ten, something like that.

  Christoph Paul And I'm like, all right, that's cool that there's still video store around. You know, I, I could do that. You know, that's a decent job. You know, I'm doing my own writing and stuff, and I go there and I realize it's fucking porn store, you know, it's like they had, like, they had like a front, like, regular movies, and they're like, the worst movies you ever seen.

  Christoph Paul Like, shit that you can't sell, you know? And then I go in the back, I'm like, Oh, okay. And you see, you, you know? And it was weird. Zoning laws, like, you couldn't call dildos, dildos. You had to stay. There were medical devices you had, like, vibrators were medical devices. They couldn't actually be vibrators. And I got very good at selling vibrators, by the way.

  Christoph Paul Like, it was like I became like an artist of selling because this an awkward thing for a girl. She's coming in. She's like in this porn stores, mostly dudes. They're all looking at her because they're all fucking horny. They're not getting pussy. They're, they're, they're jerking off to porn, so it's already awkward they're getting that skin in the eye and, you know, and I got like teachers and stuff like that.

  Christoph Paul And, you know, you get, like, just women who are working their asses off. They don't have a time, like, a decent guy. They're just like, I don't want to deal with them. Bad men are so bad. I rather just get a fucking vibrator and, like, get a movie for five 99. Like, those decent looking women. Like, these are good looking women.

  Christoph Paul They're just so fed up with dating in D.C., which is a shitty place to date, by the way. I we can get into that in a little bit, but because Jesus Christ, they are awful. But, you know, so, you know, see, you know, you're just like, all right. And you had to just be really sensitive and honestly, I think this has helped me become a publisher being a porn star playing because like, you know, you I'm working with a lot of female writers and you're like, they're being very intimate with you.

  Christoph Paul They're like telling, you know, it's like you have to be really gentle, no judging. You're like, hey, this is just, hey, you know, this is going to really feel good on the clitoris, you know? And that's what it's about. You're just like, you really have to be kind. And you can't make me feel awful awkward. Like there's a real art to selling a vibrator as a non-gay dude.

  Christoph Paul You a woman and you can, like, make it be, like, creepy. You can't, like, make them think, oh, he's going to jerk off about me later. Like, it's just like, no, I'm here to do this right I did have a tragic story, though. I had a girl from. She's from some. I want to say. Yeah, it was Ethiopia, not Somalia.

  Christoph Paul Ethiopia, female, circumcised so sad. These beautiful towns like not I don't know. She's talented. Just like I adored this girl. She was just really beautiful. Beautiful. Ethiopian woman, got an arranged marriage, had her clitoris chopped off, basically, and she wanted to fucking masturbate. And I had to basically teach this woman to masturbate made by, like, G-spot stimulation because you have to dress.

  Christoph Paul And I'm like, yeah, you got to do this. And it was like, this is this is more than I bargained for with this job, you know? And it became like. And then I noticed because we lived by a hospital for vets, and I'm like, these guys would come in so it was like, I always say this. I feel like I did more for the community in D.C. by people coming in because they just needed a guy to talk to.

  Christoph Paul Like I was basically a shrink at the end. And that's probably why I thought about being a shrink. These guys would come in, they needed to talk, I'd listen to them, you know, they're fucking war veterans. Like, they sacrifice their life, you know, and they're got missing legs. And shit. And I just listen to them and talk to them.

  Christoph Paul And I'm a good listener and, you know, these girls have come in and they just like lonely, you know? So it was a darkness in the porn store, too. I mean, it was a great job, but, you know, you got a lot of lonely people and. Yeah, but her fuckin husband, the Ethiopian, her husband found out and I never heard from her again.

  Christoph Paul I was really fucking sad about that because I think God knows what happened.

  Matt Slayer Her end up in the farm blotter.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. No, like, is not good. I knew this as soon as they called me, she was like, call me and just say, Hey, how's it going? And you talk about, like, American Idol, like, you just wanted to, like, learn more about American culture. You know.

  Matt Slayer What? She's just a refugee here.

  Christoph Paul I'm not sure. You know, she didn't really get. I know she was married, you know, and I know the guy was not a good guy. And, you know, it was there's some darkness at the porn store.

  Matt Slayer Unfortunately, yeah.

  Christoph Paul I mean, the owner, it's it's it's a bring it back to little light. The owner was the seventies. He's 70. His girlfriend was like 35 he had a fucking wig. He was super Italian guy, Nick, and he he had the gold mine of a business at one time. You know, he made so much money selling porn in the eighties and nineties and early 2000, then 20, ten comes.

  Christoph Paul He's like, why am I not making any fucking money here? You know? And then like, man, he was just God. He would just like, he wanted me to like tell people there's like you listen, you need to tell these guys that there's communist spies on the internet. I'm like, What the fuck does that even mean? He's like, They're going to spy on them.

  Christoph Paul It's Commie like he's just like and he's like, still in the eighties, like we're in.

  Matt Slayer The Red Scare is going to stop people from jerking off.

  Christoph Paul Online. Exactly. He really thought that that was going to work. And he was like, Man, it was like the turn of the day problematic. So, you know, the majority of the dudes that came in with the neighborhood who was at there were like, 90% were black men. Over 40. He's like, I got an idea to get, you know, the customers happy.

  Christoph Paul We're going to get some watermelon God. And I was like, What the fuck? I just like you know, I can't say to my boss, like, That's fucking racist. That's not.

  Matt Slayer Good. Do you want us to sell fried chicken to what the fuck?

  Christoph Paul You know? And then we had for Christmas, we had this like Barry White singing Santa. He's like, all the brothers love this. Seems like Chris, you got to get the big ass stuff, you know, don't get this other shit. The big ass. That's what they like. It was just like, now I'm going to write about this. This is like the thing I need to write about because I feel like enough time has passed and there's like, a nostalgia for, like, the late 2000 early.

  Christoph Paul You know, I got to write, like, what's called auto fiction. I'm basically just like, well, fictionalize a few things, but yeah, I got to write the because I dated to there you know, and DC is like the most professional managerial, whatever you want to call it, class. You know, they're all working for the government, they're all working reports.

  Christoph Paul And here I am like, this is fucking nobody want to be a writer, a musician who's working at a porn store. Not a good place to date if that's it.

  Matt Slayer I'm sure you're a novelty to some of.

  Christoph Paul Them. They like the idea of it, you know, and they, you know, I hooked up here and there, but it was like I to keep it real I ended up only dating black women while there because the white women, they're, they're either obsessed with Ayn Rand are they're fucking like ridiculous hippie leftists. And I didn't fit in with either of those groups, you know, I'm just doing my thing.

  Christoph Paul So I ended up like, you know, dating mostly. I guess you could call my my white boy somewhere in D.C.. I'm going to get canceled for this hour. And I know.

  Matt Slayer Ten years from now, don't wait ten years.

  Christoph Paul No, I just was like, you know, like, I remember these Republican girls and they just want to, like, be like, oh, my God. You knows Ayn Rand who wanted me to be, you know, really taught me the truth of life. I'm like, bitch, you just want to be selfish. Like.

  Matt Slayer I ran, died on welfare. Come on, come on.

  Christoph Paul Like, give me a break. And then, like, you know, it was funny. Like, the Republican girls are actually cooler to me just because they were less snobby and the leftist girls would be like, you work at a porn star. Like, it was just, like, not a good fit for me.

  Matt Slayer It's like, ladies. Yeah, I work in a market that is empowering women to do what they want with their body.

  Christoph Paul No, it was just not a good fit. The musicians scene was bad. I mean, I finally find a drummer. He's 40 years old. He lives with his mom. He, you know, it's just like, I'm not going to go anywhere if I want to do music and writing. This is not the place for me. And then my buddy had a, you know, a job in the Department of Labor so I.

  Christoph Paul I end up in New York, you know, so I'd like to write like a couple books about just the nonfiction journey to, you know, from DC to New York.

  Matt Slayer This is just.

  Christoph Paul I hate it. I mean, I love, you know. No, no, I love the city. It's such a well-laid out city. It's perfect. You have all these bands coming in. You have great writers visiting. I just couldn't stand the they're just not my people. Like, I'm not into like like I remember they're talking about IRA's, and I'm like, why are we talking about the Irish Republican Army?

  Christoph Paul And that's like I learned that's a that's not that it's like a retirement fund. And I'm like, these motherfuckers are drinking and talking about Ira. Like, I don't belong here. This is not my crowd. I'm not one to talk about IRA's. So I left, you know, when I was able to leave, I was. But the porn star was a good gig.

  Christoph Paul I mean, I look back on that with, you know, there is some sad shit there, but, you know, I you know, it was I learned a lot about life.

  Matt Slayer I mean, there's such sheltered life.

  Christoph Paul Everywhere. That's life, you know? But it was I mean, I really have fond memories of the porn store, like. Yeah, it was a depressing, shitty job. Like, any, like, most jobs to be honest.

  Matt Slayer Most retail jobs.

  Christoph Paul Most retail jobs for sure. But, you know, I look back on it is mostly good memories.

  Matt Slayer Do you ever check in to see if the porn star still exists?

  Christoph Paul Oh, it's gone. It's a it's a we dispensary now, you know.

  Matt Slayer Modern retail.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. I mean, it was that was it. Nick passed away. You know, that's that's tough. We were all supposed to get the store Nick was going to give us the store cuts because it wasn't making any money at the end at the end of it. So, you know, but that's life. That's life.

  Matt Slayer That's sad. It's sad to do That's another thing that unions will never get to really experience fucking the nerve wracking experience of walking into a pawn time.

  Christoph Paul It's just really not. I mean, it's they're there, but they're like, novels.

  Matt Slayer But, you.

  Christoph Paul Know, they're not the same. You don't.

  Matt Slayer Have to.

  Christoph Paul Yeah.

  Matt Slayer Back in my day.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, I know.

  Matt Slayer Back in my day, I didn't.

  Christoph Paul Go on Twitter. Right now, you just look up. Oh, your gear that's there.

  Matt Slayer Yeah, a little. The last night was just trying to be an asshole on Twitter and like, tweet funny shit. Yeah. And like, I had to sort through my time and find stuff that was not buttholes. Like, yeah, I just love to react to that. It's not just porn people. It's just, you know.

  Christoph Paul And you have only fans now. I mean, it's, it's weird. I mean, you have like, like all, like, meet, like writers. I'm like, oh, they're cool. And they, they having all these fans, you know, it's, it's like, it's just that's where we're at, you know, it's just not a big deal.

  Matt Slayer And that's awesome.

  Christoph Paul It is I'm 100% for it. Yeah.

  Matt Slayer Get rid of the stigma of sex. Work is awesome.

  Christoph Paul I'm 100% like we'll be publishing like a poetry book in 20, 24. We haven't officially announced it, but it's basically a poetry book and we're publishing way less poetry because it is hard to sell, but we're publishing like a pro sex work poetry book and I'm like, fuck yeah, I'm all about that. I'm very proud you know, especially after doing that gig, I'm like, you know, people got to make money, you know, that's where it's at.

  Matt Slayer If you reduce the stigma on it, more people.

  Christoph Paul You know.

  Matt Slayer Can take that opportunity and not be negatively affected by it later on in life.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, it's not a big deal. It's not a big deal, but.

  Matt Slayer Hopefully everyone you know is fucked.

  Christoph Paul Yeah.

  Matt Slayer Some of them have just done it on camera.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. I mean, it's, you know, people that make a big deal. I don't know. I mean, we had to deal with that too, you know, at the point. So there are people always trying to shut it down and like I meant to the community and blah, blah, blah. But people wanted it, you know. Yeah, people.

  Matt Slayer I demand it's.

  Christoph Paul Capitalism. That's what it is exactly.

  Matt Slayer I definitely remember like the first times as a young and like having to go through the fucking cowboy doors. The good.

  Christoph Paul Boy doors. Yeah, that's what we had. We have those cowboy doors is it a cowboy towards R or bids, right?

  Matt Slayer Every time. Like, why? Why?

  Christoph Paul Yeah. I don't know why. That's a good that's a good question. I have to I have to think about that one.

  Matt Slayer You know, every fucking porn store, every fucking video store that had a porn section since the beginning of time, like little beads or fucking fallen doors. Why?

  Christoph Paul There's probably a psychology behind it. That just caught on, you know, it's like the forbidden you you're going through. I mean, there's like some young in psychology, probably, like, you're entering a new, new sphere. So I was like, well.

  Matt Slayer I'm sure part of it is also you want a door that makes a little most of the it tends to be like it's.

  Christoph Paul For the kids to like because, yeah, that was the other thing, you know, that's that's the one area we had to worry about with like if you get like a 16 year old or somebody in there and then we're fucked, then we're getting close, you know, they, they're looking for us. They were looking for us to like fuck up in some ways.

  Christoph Paul So we had like people checking in, making sure, you know, we had to have a certain percentage of only sex. Like, it was just like they were just, they're just squeezing they're like, we're going to make sure that this porn star eventually closes and that's fucked up, you know? So that's always why I'm a little like, you know, I'm just you should be able to do what you want you know?

  Christoph Paul And if it's just if it's not hurting, anybody is actually doing good for the community. You have a fucking hospital two blocks away of vets, vets. You just need to talk somebody. And I did more good than some of these fucking churches, honestly, near it to.

  Matt Slayer Be all more than a lot of churches.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. So, you know.

  Matt Slayer Churches are doing a lot of harm at times.

  Christoph Paul They do. They do. They definitely do.

  Matt Slayer God damn. I really am becoming an activist. Fuck.

  Christoph Paul I'm like, whatever. I just don't care anymore. I mean, my wife believes, you know, she's a believer and, like, whatever. I don't even know what effort nonsense there is, but.

  Matt Slayer If your wife leaves them whatever nonsense and you don't, what do you instill in your child?

  Christoph Paul Yeah, it'll be interesting. I mean, honestly, he can believe what he wants.

  Matt Slayer Yeah, but you got to give him some guidance when it comes to his questions. You know, your wife's having to be radically different answers. Than you are.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. And he can whatever sounds better to him, go with it. I mean, you know, I'm not one that I don't have the answers. I'm not going to say I know. Like, I don't know if there's a God or I can't say for certain. There is no. The only thing I know is I don't have certainty, you know, is there fucking fairies and shit?

  Christoph Paul Probably not. You know.

  Matt Slayer I believe in God if you're not really good. For example, first of all, I don't exist, but God might.

  Christoph Paul I, I can't understand the full universe like a pure scientific way. Like it's there, though, and you're probably better off. Like, I'm not a believer I'm. I would fall under extreme agnostic to the point of atheist, but I can't say for any kind of certainty that I know. I mean, I my thing is like, hey, we don't know.

  Christoph Paul I'm pretty sure there's not a fucking hell and all that nonsense. You know, it's a shitty thing to think about death, but if we're all going to have it, there's no escaping it. I don't know what's going to happen. I mean, all you can do is kind of enjoy the life you have now. And I think that if that's not your philosophy, you are in the wrong.

  Matt Slayer 100% because people are like, Oh, I'm going to do things to ensure I have great internal life. Like, Motherfucker, you're here, you're here.

  Christoph Paul That's all you have. You don't know you might as well enjoy it, you know? And that's, that's really that's the only really good philosophy. Try to be a decent person to you. I do believe that. I don't think you have to do that to be general.

  Matt Slayer You shouldn't have to have your invisible parent figure in the sky makes you be a decent person.

  Christoph Paul So, I mean, it's just better for you to be a decent person because that's shit's you don't that's it will come back to you. Like, I'm not even saying karma. Like, if you live a shitty life and you're shitty to other people, other people, chances are going to be shitty to you.

  Matt Slayer Know, your man and a president.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. I mean, you're going to be that. You might be that one fucking escape, but you're that means you already probably have billions of millions of dollars and that's a whole other thing.

  Matt Slayer Oh yeah. Well, it's also like there's a study that showed that like the amount of fortune 500 CEOs that are like fucking sociopaths.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, you you might need to be a sociopath, and, you know, that's you. I mean, there's not, you're not going to have many consequences. I mean, that, that is the trade off with, like, accepting, you know, without a God and all that. But I rather have that and let some asshole be a rich CEO than us just like, try to follow some moral code that we have no idea even, you know, there's no scientific basis.

  Christoph Paul I mean, we have psychology, we have science, we have so many things that we can base what is good for humans and what's not that you can make an educated guess on how you want to live.

  Matt Slayer Well, and the thing about it is organized religion definitely served a point in human history. It definitely we needed it. Oh, yeah, we needed it.

  Christoph Paul We were fucking BS. Yeah.

  Matt Slayer And pork would fucking kill you. I understand.

  Christoph Paul Exactly.

  Matt Slayer Exactly.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. So, I mean, you know, now we, we can eat some pork. Oh, yeah, it's good. I love fucking bacon. You know, I'm Italian Jew. I was going to eat bacon three times a week. It's delicious.

  Matt Slayer I had some prosciutto right before you came over here.

  Christoph Paul Zito's fucking great. Yeah, I mean, that's the Italian. I mean, I fucking love prosciutto, you know, to not eat prosciutto, that's a sin, right? That's not living. How can you pass a prosciutto baba ghoul? Come on. Like, you know. Yeah, hell.

  Matt Slayer When I was in Spain, like, every fucking bar has the hormone, like. But but, you.

  Christoph Paul Know, I was. I was blessed to go to Barcelona for, like, a writing thing, and it was fuck me. And that place is paradise. I miss Barcelona.

  Matt Slayer I haven't been to northern Spain. I was in Madrid in that on the Mediterranean coast.

  Christoph Paul Oh, man.

  Matt Slayer Yeah, it was. But every fucking bar we went to do oh, there's just a fucking ham hock there. Their supplies, the.

  Christoph Paul The only way to live. Oh, that's the way to live, you know. Yeah. I mean, you don't. I'm not saying you have to be a hedonist. I think that. Well, why not? I mean, you can, you can actually actually really what's works for you. I mean, when all is said and done, you know.

  Matt Slayer Trying to make it work try.

  Christoph Paul You know, Hedonism five, I think it actually depends. It really depends where you're like, I like, you know, what it is where I'm at, I have so much shit going on that I know I can't do certain things now. You know I can't do, sir. I just can't, you know, because I have such a full plate that, you know, I can yeah.

  Christoph Paul Just certain things. It's like it's not worth it for me to do. And that's really I really believe it's really it's there's really no right answer. It's really your answer.

  Matt Slayer Oh, well, and that's part of the reason I don't want kids because, you know, when you have to be responsible for another human life, you can't.

  Christoph Paul Do, you can't do. I can say it. I am exhausted all the fucking time I like what I'm doing is some like Nietzsche Ubermensch like nonsense. I am like, fucking like Magneto showing life. I'm just building I'm like, like, like how he turns like metal and just like, I don't know how I'm doing this, but I'm doing it.

  Christoph Paul But I'm definitely there's a trade off for it, and that's I'm tired all the time. You know, it's. I'm tired. And you going to take a break in May. I'm looking forward to that. But I'm like, I got to set out a time to just take a break and like plan a break three months in advance. Like, that's what I've had to do.

  Christoph Paul So, you know, it's just straight off. Like, I, you got to know who you are. Like, I, I've learned about myself that and this is I'm probably in a very small minority. I really like pushing myself to my limit. And that's when I feel most alive. And I guess I'm you know, it's almost sadistic. Not that. No, it's masochistic.

  Christoph Paul Excuse me. In a way I like to like. All right. How far can I go before I think I'm going to crash? And I just I like that. I like living like that. So I like having this full plate. I like being stressed out. There's a certain personality type I.

  Matt Slayer Think it's a very Jewish.

  Christoph Paul Thing. It's a Jewish thing. No, that's.

  Matt Slayer I. I can relate to all of that.

  Christoph Paul So I'm like, hardcore Jewish mother, hardcore workaholic. Father, Italian. So it's just like, it's just my nature, you know? It's like, I feel weird if I'm not doing that, so, you know, but that's me. I don't think 90% of people should live, like, how I'm living, where they're like, Oh, let's do three things and do all this shit, and then just collapse for a day and then go.

  Matt Slayer Oh, I probably feel guilty about that.

  Christoph Paul Collapse and feel guilt. Oh, yeah.

  Matt Slayer I have that all the fucking time. Like, I need to fucking take a day. And then I'm like, Well, I took a fucking day. Yeah.

  Christoph Paul And then it's like, there's always still something going on you know, because it's not the suppress I got. There's always something with oppress. Like, it's like people think like publishing is glamorous or fucking, like, maybe for the big, but even the big for like even corporate publishing is like it's a stressful industry. Like, you have to just be okay with that and your music's fine.

  Christoph Paul I mean, but now that we're like, trying to do something with it, it's still now it's like a gig.

  Matt Slayer Yeah, the business of music is definitely stressful.

  Christoph Paul It's stressful. I mean, you just so you know, it's easier to promote music than books. Because it's just easier to get people to click and listen for 2 minutes where a book, you're like, Fuck that. Yeah, I don't have time for that. So it's much harder to sell books than to get people to listen to music. But you can't really make money on music anymore.

  Christoph Paul You can make money selling books. Trust me, I'm doing all right. Very hard to make money with music. So that's a whole other industry like we where Spotify has really fucked musicians, Amazon people, people that people don't like the Kindle as much as Amazon thought they were. People still read regular books. They like the physical media you are getting.

  Christoph Paul CD's are weirdly coming back really? Yeah. There's people actually buying CDs.

  Matt Slayer Like I understand vinyl coming back. I don't understand Citi's coming there.

  Christoph Paul It's not as much as vinyl is actually really coming back vinyl is like, that's here. But I don't, you know, we'll see how much, you know, people can afford to buy vinyl. We will. We'll do one down the road, but it's not like depressing. But people are what it is. They'll buy the CD, but they'll like be able to.

  Christoph Paul They like the physical media, but they'll have the download code so like, if so, they can't play the CD. At least they have it. There is still a craving, I think, for physical media.

  Matt Slayer Well, and there should be because at the end of the day, I found this out with buying digital movies. And so I thought if Apple or whoever loses the rights to it, they just pull it from your fucking library and they don't tell you.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, exactly. It's you just you're there's no guarantees if that's your favorite movie or favorite song, you don't.

  Matt Slayer Know. Yeah. It's gone from your library.

  Christoph Paul You don't know. Yeah, we should mention that. I mean, yeah, you have like Twitter now you know, and it's interesting because like, literally, this is the day Ellen bought Twitter. I should mention it. And it's, you know, as a publisher, we've done Twitter it's been amazing for class books. We got the Eve sixth book because of Twitter as literally the only reason why even six Texas publishing with us.

  Christoph Paul Max, God bless them. It's because of Twitter. So you know, Ellen, I'm not a fan of them personally. I don't like the dude, you know, I mean, I'm I'm not going to like any real billionaire. Not because I'm even like, oh, fuck billionaires. I'm just like, you probably did some scumbag shit to become a billionaire.

  Matt Slayer Yeah. You don't become a billionaire with no playing nice.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. You know, you. So there's something off usually about you, you know, you know, but I want to like, I always like to try to look deeper and things so I my hope with with Ellen, and I'm not I mean, I hate how he's done on labor like, you know, not to get too blue. Like, I mean, there's some shit, you know, what he's done.

  Christoph Paul Like the racial profiling, you know, his background being from a park side fucking south like these are not good things. And I do see, I have some friends. Even the hero worshiping of turning Ellen into fucking Tony Stark is some of the dumbest shit I have encountered in a long time. Like, come on, y'all know is not that he's made some really smart moves.

  Christoph Paul He's like.

  Matt Slayer Made some really fucking dumb ones, too.

  Christoph Paul He's made a huge dumb ones. He realized he could get government subsidies for doing electric cars and get get propped up. And then, you know, he's a ruthless motherfucker. My hope for Ellen, him being kind of to use a non-PC word, but an artist, so to speak, is that he's looking at free speech as this, like, Watchmen type mission where I have to watch over I have to protect free speech.

  Christoph Paul Like, even if they talk shit about me, I'm going to let it in. That's going to have some bad shit, too, you know, like, I, you know, I'm my hobby is I like to look up about cults, but I've found Que Anon fascinating. Online cults seem, you know, you might get cute on people back on Twitter.

  Matt Slayer Oh, I'm sure they'll come back.

  Christoph Paul They're coming back. You probably have Trump back. And that's I, I don't like Trump, but it's like the just the Trump show. I'm like, oh, god, it's going to come back because I got to, like, promote books. That's why I'm on Twitter. I make funny jokes to it. That's nice. It's cool. But I'm on there to do my small business.

  Christoph Paul I'm a small business owner. That's why I'm on Twitter. There is no other reason for that. That's my main reason. I like to talk basketball here, but it's fun. But I'm there to spread the word for my authors. So the fact that I'm gonna have to, like, you know, now deal with fucking MAGA, judge, and then, like, resist him.

  Christoph Paul Like, I'm not looking forward to that. You know, because they're both crazy and cringe. I'm not excited about that, but we'll see. You know, then again, though, to just be, you know, to see the good of it. If 60, I love that's going to be my moneymaker. How to keep it real. That's going to make, you know, that's going to do well for us.

  Christoph Paul He got suspended for saying, let's put landlords into a blender. He got suspended on Twitter for that. That's fucked up. That should not happen. Well, Elon Musk make it so that if six is not going to get suspended for making a fucking obvious pop culture joke, hopefully we'll see you know, we'll see. Sometimes, you know my philosophy in life, I'm gonna stay right here.

  Christoph Paul And this is very Jewish right here. There's two things in life. Sometimes you get penicillin, so there's three things. And that's the good you get the penicillin. And then there's chlamydia and cancer. And hopefully Iran will be chlamydia. You can deal with chlamydia. You won't die from it.

  Matt Slayer As we lovingly refer to it as a porno called.

  Christoph Paul A porno called. Exactly. There's penicillin, you know, there's antibiotics for it. Maybe he does some crazy shit like I hate his stuff. Like, you know, I get it. I get where people are coming from. He's he's kind of awful. But if he's going to make it that, you know, it's just you're not going to get suspended for shit like that.

  Christoph Paul Fine. You know.

  Matt Slayer What? I'm really looking forward to his claim if he actually falls through with this to actually without bots.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, no, that would be great. So, okay, you're. I'm on board for that. I'm not a fan of you, but. All right, if you're going to be a big boy, you know, I think this is a midlife crisis and that's, you know, whatever. Fine. I don't give a shit. That's your business. Y y you're motivated to do this.

  Christoph Paul I like to own this site. You do kind of have to be a crazy person. This is not going to be fun. Like, you're going to have to deal with these weird gray areas of, you know, like, I don't think Twitter is going to turn into eight channel or whatever. Probably not. You know, I don't know if they're going to let all I mean, you.

  Christoph Paul That's the other thing, too, is he I did study politics in college. I actually did get a political science degree. I don't really even like politics anymore, but I know how, you know, that shit works. And if he's like, positioning himself as like a friend of the right, but then going to actually do policies on Twitter that people on the left will PS he might be really fucking smart, you know, where he's like, hey, you know, I, I'm on your side.

  Christoph Paul I believe in free speech, but we can't have you know, people calling everyone the N-word every two fucking seconds. Like, you know, you can't have a rap. I just don't want it. I mean, look, you can it's like you can block people, but at the same time, do I want to, like, be called a kike every 10 seconds? No, I if that's happening every fucking day, we have a problem on Twitter.

  Matt Slayer Well, it's not only a problem, but I also.

  Christoph Paul But I can block them. I can block them. That's true. And that's I've thought about it.

  Matt Slayer And those people's words have zero power.

  Christoph Paul Over. Exactly. So it's like, where's that middle ground? You know? Do we I don't really want to have an eight channel where, you know, I don't want to wake up in the morning and just see fucking slurs. I want to see portholes. That's fine. Keep the buttholes. Not really wanting to see the N-word and anti-Semitism while I'm drinking my coffee and I'm getting ready to market my books.

  Matt Slayer Yeah, I'd prefer not to do that, too.

  Christoph Paul But, you know, at the same time, there's trade offs, like anything in life. So I think if you can find a happy middle ground with that, you know, but that's the thing. It's like there's no there's not going to be a perfect social media site. You're going to just have to pick your poison.

  Matt Slayer I mean, MySpace existed.

  Christoph Paul MySpace is pretty great looking back on it. You know, I mean, we.

  Matt Slayer Didn't know how good we had it.

  Christoph Paul No, it was actually, you know, looking back on it, it was not bad. You know, Thomas, you know Thomas. All right.

  Matt Slayer Yes. You might go to president, give you a computer, basically virtual cancer.

  Christoph Paul But yeah, but you know, what? You know, that was your choice. You could go to their page and you could leave another page. You know what.

  Matt Slayer I'm just saying? So that is Jim. I'll be like, oh, god, what did I just do to my computer?

  Christoph Paul Yeah, that that that sucked I mean, the the interface, but the idea of it wasn't bad. I mean, I'm stuck on Twitter. I have to be on there. I have three sites. Like, I have three. I basically run the class books, Twitter. That's the big one. I run my band's Twitter, you know, and I have my own and it's like I'm stuck on there, you know?

  Christoph Paul So I just don't want the site to like, I don't want to feel like I'm on force and if I don't have to, but I can always mute words. Like, it's just like, I just don't want to have to do extra labor.

  Matt Slayer I wholeheartedly agree. But I also I have a lot of love for Twitter.

  Christoph Paul I'd, I'd be.

  Matt Slayer To I've been on Twitter since 2000.

  Christoph Paul Nine. Oh, you're OG like I'm I'm a how I think 2011.

  Matt Slayer I, I got on Twitter. Yeah I had to text me fucking tweets.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. You're old school that stuff.

  Matt Slayer And Twitter has done things for my career I've seen. Oh just like the fact that every other social media you have to be mutually connected versus. Yeah. Oh hey I can that mentioned somebody and there's a good chance they're going to fucking see this especially back in the day. Yeah. I did a bunch of networking and met a bunch of people who are still friends to this day over fucking Twitter.

  Christoph Paul Yeah no same. I mean it's the benefit outweighs the negative in a million ways. In a million ways. I think just I'm looking at it from like the change I mean, honestly, when all said and done, I don't think it's really going to be that big of a deal. I don't think much is going to change. I don't you know, I mean, I'm there with a purpose.

  Christoph Paul I'm not there to get self esteem. I'm there to fucking sell books. I mean, other publishing people talk about my music, make funny. I like making funny tweets. It's nice. It's just something good in life. You know, a funny joke comes to my head. I can share it with some people. I'll get like eight, ten likes, maybe 50 if I'm lucky.

  Christoph Paul Whatever, you know, and it's like it's nice. So I don't know. I mean, there's a lot worse. Like, I definitely was not a fan of Trump Elon Musk. Like, they're all scum, like, you know what I mean? Like, like, that's the thing. Like, people are like, you know, oh, he's awful. He's, you know, blah, blah, blah. But it's like so the other tech billionaires, is it really that much of it?

  Christoph Paul He's just more honest about his shadiness.

  Matt Slayer How someone pointed is like, yeah, Jack Dorsey is a saint.

  Christoph Paul You know, like, that's. Yeah, that's the shit that pisses me off. Like, on that with that group. Like, I guess you could call neoliberals or whatever. It's like, no, Jack Dorsey is not a saint. The fucking what's his name, the other billionaire Microsoft guy. He's not a saint either. Like, he's. Yeah, he's great fund philanthropic like, you know, and, and it's crazy that people think he's putting microchips in.

  Matt Slayer But the thing with Bill Gates is his philanthropic, but he gets to choose how he still is. Not just like, yeah, he's not paying his fair share of taxes. No. To make sure.

  Christoph Paul Like that's a good.

  Matt Slayer Point.

  Christoph Paul Aren't paying any taxes. It's the same. The billionaires are not paying taxes. You know, these guys can do whatever the fuck they want with their money. They they have figured out a way they have the best accountants in the world that they're going to figure out a way to just keep all the money they can. And that's good.

  Matt Slayer I'm not the horde of you like fucking dragons.

  Christoph Paul I mean, you could. You could. They could. They could. The five of them got together. They could pretty much at least help end hunger to some degree in this country.

  Matt Slayer They could flood out as you. And how much? Like, give me a plan to end world hunger. Yeah. How soon cost? And then you will play. You just chose to ignore it.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, it's 20, I think it was 20 billion.

  Matt Slayer Yeah. Half of the cost of Twitter, you know.

  Christoph Paul So, I mean, you know, it's just, it sucks. It sucks that you know, you're going to the people that end up with the most money are kind of sociopathic and there's nothing you can do about that. You're never going to get like a nice billionaire. It's not going to exist. You might get a nice millionaire, you get lucky and they're like, Oh, I'm a millionaire, you know, I got lucky.

  Matt Slayer I mean, I may not be a millionaire for long and.

  Christoph Paul Then won't be a millionaire for long. They won't be a millionaire for a year. Or two. And then they're going to be a regular person again. And they might be happy like that, but you're going to have people would just like God complexes and granny and clearly Ellen.

  Matt Slayer Ellen does. Well, yeah. Who else would come up with the fucking tunnel system for the boring company?

  Christoph Paul I come on, man.

  Matt Slayer Like, let's make inefficient subways, everyone.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. It's like you know, he, you know, it's just he's like, not even a poor man's Tony Stark. He's like a crackhead. Tony Stark. Like, he's just the the. That's my I think that's the thing that annoys me the most. Just the he the hero. I mean, I'm against hero worship of anybody. When all is said, like politicians especially, but like Elon Musk, it's like, come on, guys.

  Christoph Paul Like, this guy's just, you know. Well.

  Matt Slayer The best part about that is that's naive. If you look back at like the history of Tony Stark, not MCU movie. Tony Stark, Tony Stark piloted the Iron Man's armor drunk and almost accidentally killed people. Yeah. Tony Stark was not a good guy. For a.

  Christoph Paul Hollywood dude, for a.

  Matt Slayer Good chunk of. Yeah, well, can I remember?

  Christoph Paul That's what made him great. You're like, oh, he was an asshole. And he found a deeper purpose.

  Matt Slayer But he was also a fucking.

  Christoph Paul Alcoholic. Yes, absolutely.

  Matt Slayer You know, and had all the alcohol tendencies to go with it.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. I mean, and, you know, and that's a great that's that's a writer and editor. That's like that's great storytelling. It's a great arc. You know, you are. My boss is like, all right, I've fucked up my third marriage. Let me try to save free speech. And what I think you know what I mean? It's like.

  Matt Slayer What else? Just me that, you know, almost is not a good guy. Grimes was, when they were still together, was tweeting about that. He wasn't supporting her music career. Like you have hundreds of billions of dollars. You're not going to support your baby mamas fuckin music career.

  Christoph Paul I you could it's easily done. Like he's weird. You know, he's a weird guy. That way. He's like, just.

  Matt Slayer How much wealth do you have to hoard? Like, you.

  Christoph Paul Know, he's like, super cheap. He's super cheap. He like, yeah.

  Matt Slayer If I had if I had a couple million, I don't, I don't I mean, he's of Grimes, his music, I think about supporting Grimes, his music. Oh, yeah.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, she's Grimes, but I'm.

  Matt Slayer Not having sex with her.

  Christoph Paul I saw a funny tweet today, and it's like the debate is like, is Grimes pussy so good that it fucking did this Elon Musk. Ah, was it so bad and I think it was so good that losing that to some degree, it's just made him go on the deep supporter.

  Matt Slayer Fucking music career. She by not a fucking left asshole.

  Christoph Paul I mean, that's the thing. Like, you know, dude, when you fuck up three marriages, basically, it's like, you know, man have some priorities. Like you fuck up your marriage again. You got, you know, a baby mama and you're you're focused on like the thing I think Twitter in a way is like it's so awesome and it is like I'm with you.

  Christoph Paul It's done so much good for me but man, when Twitter's like your focus in life, that's when shit's going off. You need to, like, kind of reevaluate so and he's it's no different Elon like and it's weird. I think that makes him relatable. It's like, hey, this billionaire is also fucking miserable to that. He's obsessed with Twitter like me and I'm making 30 grand and I hate my life.

  Christoph Paul Do I like this guy? It's a weird thing. And he co-hosts Boomer shit like it's Boomer awful jokes and it's like I I don't know if he's doing that purposely to make him relatable. Like, I don't know if it's a political move. Like he's like, I'm purposely going to make myself super relatable to like the common man. Or if he just really genuinely is just fucking lame.

  Christoph Paul I don't know.

  Matt Slayer I don't either. And that's the greatest mystery.

  Christoph Paul It really is like is this guy fucking brilliant? And in a way, like the way I kind of Trump was where he like this rich asshole, fuck me, dude's making like 20 grand of a year if you like. That's my guy. He gets me.

  Matt Slayer Because he talks like me.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, he talks like me. I would be that's how I would be if I was rich, you know, I'd be a fucking piece of shit too. I relate to this. Maybe that's how people feel with you on, you know, it's like, yeah, fucking pronouns are fucking stupid. I feel this. You know what I mean? It's. It's like that kind of anger and bullshit.

  Christoph Paul Like. Like this is a shit you care about.

  Matt Slayer I mean, he spoke to Joe Rogan. He's got to be cool, right?

  Christoph Paul Yeah, exactly. So it's like, you know, these guys are really good at what they do. So I would lean more toward this is. I'm just hoping this is not a nefarious fucking plot. I'm really hoping this is like, megalomania read like Elon's like I am the bastion of free speech. This is my mission. I'm going to get man to Mars, and I'm going to protect Twitter and you know what?

  Christoph Paul That's fine. Good. Okay, fine. But I don't know if that's it.

  Matt Slayer Well, and I feel like if it does do something nefarious, it will be small and subversive.

  Christoph Paul Very small. You won't even notice, right? Like, it would be like fucking late making sort of laborer movements like I look, I got to get props, not political guy, but to the people as a publisher, I'm obviously not a huge fan of Amazon, so it's personal. Like the guy Smalls, I think his name is who started the guy who started the union with Amazon.

  Christoph Paul Oh yeah. A guy like much respect to that dude that is a hero to me. Like, good Amazon's fucking shit. They're fucking like they're they own like we have no choice. No choice to fucking deal with Amazon. It would be career suicide. We have no choice. And it sucks as we know, we're making like, blood money on that and it sucks.

  Christoph Paul And that's publishing. There's nothing I can do.

  Matt Slayer Believe me, I'm of two minds, but I literally recently applied for a job at podcasting at Amazon, so it's like, yeah, like.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, no, it sucks. Like, I.

  Matt Slayer Can't. I made money from Twitch. They were Amazon to my books.

  Christoph Paul I'm not taking my, my presses books off Amazon. You know, I might now I'm like joined a distributor, so I have to just rely on Kindle that's nice, you know, but they're not going anywhere. But so like that, you know, is good. Now is like, you know, if Ellen is like, I'm doing this to squash labor's shit, that's really fucking the evil.

  Matt Slayer Well, and the thing about is, if he does do it to squash labor's shit, it'll be subtle. It'll be like.

  Christoph Paul Yes.

  Matt Slayer It's like a banned labor. Notice it. Yeah. It just won't show up in your fucking timeline. Yeah.

  Christoph Paul And that's, that's scary. That's scary because that you get a lot of nonsense. I feel like, you know, with, with American politics, that really doesn't matter. It's like wrestling. It's entertaining for people like the woke verse and all this nonsense. It doesn't affect you really in any fucking way for the most part.

  Matt Slayer Or people or people getting upset about things that they can affect. They're just all above the pay grade like.

  Christoph Paul Come on, this is not going to do anything to your life. But that that sets the tone. That sets the tone where all of a sudden, you know, you can when you can't negotiate with huge, huge corporations and you don't have a labor union to deal with it. Fluting, masking colluding, you know, fucking Bezos, all these guys, then they have the power and they can do what the fuck they want to do.

  Matt Slayer And just imagine, like, I.

  Christoph Paul Don't think they're going to do good things.

  Matt Slayer Just imagine if Google made it so it was hard to find fuck and trade unions through a Google search.

  Christoph Paul Exactly.

  Matt Slayer That's the real terrifying.

  Christoph Paul That's scary as fuck. So yeah, I mean, I worry more about Google than a lot, honestly, because it's like the stuff he's doing, his actual jobs are not going to affect me. For the most part. Like it's I'm not working for him. I'm not going to space me. And maybe one day I will get an electric car. I don't have one right now, you know what I mean?

  Christoph Paul Like is I don't give a shit really what do almost is doing. I think the fucking tunnels are stupid. Like, that's, you know, it's more for you guys, more for L.A. than New York.

  Matt Slayer It's an efficient subway system. It's it's.

  Christoph Paul Horrible Texas. Like, come on. It's near full. Yeah, Google, Google, scary. The Google really like, I mean, echo all that shit. I got to, you know, that affects your business. They have a lot of power, you know, and they're, you know, it's funny because, like, Google presents themselves is their work. They're loving and all that. We're aliens. Like, yeah, I'm a piece of shit.

  Christoph Paul And in some ways, I kind of prefer that because at least I know you are what you are where Google is like, oh, yes, we are, you know, blah, blah, blah.

  Matt Slayer The problem is.

  Christoph Paul Scumbags behind it.

  Matt Slayer They could be more scary. They could be the most altruistic company in the world, but. But they're publicly traded.

  Christoph Paul Yeah.

  Matt Slayer So just like Twitter being publicly true, that could change our fucking dime.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, exactly.

  Matt Slayer They could be the best, the most moral company on the planet today.

  Christoph Paul And their stockholders are like, hey.

  Matt Slayer We could make some more fucking money.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, we need more money. Why are you doing this? And right.

  Matt Slayer Or some other billionaire comes.

  Christoph Paul Around the ills of capitalism. I'm not saying Cap. I mean, I don't know if there's a better system. Honestly, I don't know you know, that's above my pay grade. Even though I've studied politics, I can't. I think, you know, you try to always curb it. You should do something to regulate it because it's just the fucking monster.

  Matt Slayer Well, and this is why we're supposed to have a monopoly laws in place. But, like.

  Christoph Paul Do they really work? Not really. Not really. You know, so I don't know, you know?

  Matt Slayer I mean, hell, what was it in the nineties? They're talking about breaking up Microsoft.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, you know, in the same with Google, but it's like, at the same time, they're very good. Like, I don't want Google not to be here. I don't.

  Matt Slayer I need Google.

  Christoph Paul I need Google, I need it. So it's like, I.

  Matt Slayer Need the software to be a little more user.

  Christoph Paul Friendly. This kind of org. I keep thinking of the Watchmen doing this podcast. You need a fucking Watchmen. You need like a watchmen of the tech companies.

  Matt Slayer But the problem is, do you want the government who doesn't even understand the technology to be the watchmen of the shitty watchmen?

  Christoph Paul You need something else, you know? I don't know what that's going to be.

  Matt Slayer But who do you trust to be the fucking.

  Christoph Paul Watcher exactly, though? Who watches the Watchmen? And that's where we're at. Like, that movie was kind of prophetic. The comic book was really prophetic. It was not going to be with fucking bombs. And you know, it's not Dr. Manhattan, it's fucking the tech companies that's going to be our Dr. Manhattan is these tech companies, and we're stuck with them.

  Christoph Paul We're really fucking. I mean, I'm dependent on. I saw that. I'm like, Here's my phone. I'm dependent where we're getting bigger lies.

  Matt Slayer So you and me both knew me well, though. This whole medium, it's all fucking digital.

  Christoph Paul All digital. Yeah. But at the same time, it's pretty awesome. Yeah. It's like, it's still great. Like, I rather have that. We just have to be smart about it. We just all have to be a little more like, Okay, what's going on here?

  Matt Slayer Well, the problem is the last two years is very much true that smart and human society don't go hand in hand.

  Christoph Paul No, no. And that's never going to be the case. I mean, most people most people are fucking down, I will say.

  Matt Slayer That. Yeah. If you feel.

  Christoph Paul Elitist, I don't. Well.

  Matt Slayer Look it this way. If you feel that you're of average intelligence. 49% the population is dumber than you.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. Yeah, I'm probably in the 75%. I'm not a super smart guy. I'm above average. There are 75 or people probably. I mean my IQ score, I mean like the eighties, 80% of people are fucking dumber than me and they're, you know what I mean? So I'm thinking, okay, that's half of my smarts like that. 40%. That's not, that's pretty bad because I'm not, you know, I'm stupid on some shit list.

  Christoph Paul People waste way more stupid than me. And that's like, we have to deal with that. Yep. You know.

  Matt Slayer And some of those people who are way more serious than you are willing to do things that make no fucking sense, like be violent over nothing or nothing.

  Christoph Paul Or nothing. And, you know, I mean, I have a pretty great life. I don't, I have no need to do anything stupid, you know, but there are people who have nothing good going on and are dumb. And that's, that's going to be our issues in the next couple of decades.

  Matt Slayer It's like, fuck you.

  Christoph Paul And they can gather together like the fucking incels and all that shit. They all can fucking meet up.

  Matt Slayer And that's the sort of modern technology.

  Christoph Paul There's always a dark, I mean, like youngins psychology, shit, there's a lightness and then there's a dark and we're going to get more. We get we're getting all this light, you know, we're getting all this awesomeness. Like, I'm able to my cover artists. One lives in Australia, one lives in Spain. How fucking rad is that? I don't even have to work with an American artist if I don't want to.

  Christoph Paul I have to got two super talented guys I get along with love working them both in different countries because I can talk to them online.

  Matt Slayer Who who's really an Australian?

  Christoph Paul Matthew Rivera, great artist.

  Matt Slayer Yeah. Did make up our 20.

  Christoph Paul You know, for Raphael. Robert, yeah. Matthew Rivera. Amazing guy. Awesome dude. There we go. Well, he did both of our little different things. Because, you know, that's the globalization. It's, it's fucking fantastic. But you also get fucking terrorists and you get intel like you get, you know what I mean? You get fundamentalists, you can all gathered around.

  Matt Slayer And you just get misinformation. People don't know what they can trust and what they can't.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. Oh, yeah. There's people are really fucking dumb when it comes that they have no media literacy.

  Matt Slayer Well, they have no media literacy. And you also, because of the nature of just immediate gratification, even, quote, reveal new sources are just trying to get the fucking clicks. Yeah, investigative journalism has gone out the fucking window.

  Christoph Paul It's not here. It's not here.

  Matt Slayer There's no budget for us.

  Christoph Paul I mean, and that's the thing, like, people really shit on the media, but I'm not going to defend the media, but, like, the whole media is cancer. Like, it's. I think it's chlamydia. To go back to my little analogy, there's not enough money, and they're having to deal having to fucking do the news and capitalism, they have to make money.

  Matt Slayer Well, and just much like the taxi cab company's not delivering with the Times newspapers. Oh yeah. We'll just give away our online editions for free and nobody wants to pay for something that they've been previously getting for free.

  Christoph Paul That was dumb. Yeah. You have to pay for value. You can't just totally devalue something.

  Matt Slayer But they did and so was like, Oh, hey, no one wants to cut down millions of fucking trees and actually get a physical newspaper every day.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, you know, so now. Now you're kind of fucked. So we're all kind of fucked with that. Yeah, it's a, it's a nice smorgasbord of awesomeness and shit to be living right now. You know, I think the Austin is definitely outweighs us. I will say that we are living in an amazing time where I think there is more positivity.

  Christoph Paul I mean, definitely standards of living are the best they've ever been. That's not to say, Oh, don't complain, you know, don't be an activist, don't ask for more. But, you know, that is good to remember. But yeah, I mean, I wouldn't want to be in the past. I mean, we were joking about like the twenties. Fuck that. I want to be I rather I will take Dennis over Paris.

  Christoph Paul And then I.

  Matt Slayer Also imagine doing the Spanish Flu without the internet, like the course is, especially.

  Christoph Paul For people who are Fox. They are so.

  Matt Slayer Far. I mean, all your choice at one I mean you might have enjoyed it. All you had to do is do drink it in bulk. I mean, those are your options to spend your day.

  Christoph Paul Yeah.

  Matt Slayer That's a lot of things. Yeah, there are worse things, but it's still like eventually your dick gets raw.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. You can only fuck for so long. You can only fuck for so long. So yeah, I.

  Matt Slayer I said this on air multiple times. I am happy I'm the I am where it's like, oh, I got to come up as a kid and as a young teenager in the analog age. Yeah, but I'm not so fucking old that I don't understand technology.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, I know. That's rough. I mean, you know, I've had some older writers and it's like, Jesus Christ, they just don't, you know, it's just. Yeah, it's not, it's not fun.

  Matt Slayer But I also am happy that I'm of the age of, like, I can play it outside. I hung out in pool halls and coffeehouses, and, yeah, I can have a conversation with someone that's not through a fucking screen.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, no. And I think, you know, I'm not into like, this. I think like, I like the ZOOMers, to be honest. I mean, it's not just because I'm trying to sell them. Like, I like them. They're all right, you know, they're interesting to me. I like them more than you know, fellow millennials. I think, you know, it's going to be interesting because I think they can actually because they're so saturated, I think they're actually kind of like, oh, man, this is like a real book.

  Christoph Paul This is kind of cool. You know, they're so like, physical media is actually like, a novelty for them. And I think that's a good sign.

  Matt Slayer Until they have to move apartments a couple of times and then I can book.

  Christoph Paul Suck. Yeah. Now that that's an issue, I'll deal with another you know, it's a trade off, right? Then they're like, Oh, this is fucking stupid. But, you know, until then, you know, they're all right. You know, I don't, I don't think I don't think there's like a better generation, honestly. I mean, I, I like Gen Xers for sure.

  Christoph Paul Some of them are fucking asshole. Some of them are great, just like any generation.

  Matt Slayer Well, it's, there's a good closer to the boomers yeah.

  Christoph Paul They're fucking awful. Like, I'm not a fan of the boomers, you know? I mean, most, most millennials aren't, but there's some good boomers, too. I mean, you know, the boomers that really. Yeah, we were. We were kind of bad, but.

  Matt Slayer Well, it's just while that your generation went from being a free love and, you know, sex, drugs, rock and roll, man, to. Oh, you assholes. Can't afford housing. Sounds like you're fucking problem.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. No, they're fucking dicks. I mean, you know, they don't realize how lucky they had it. And some of that, like, historically, it's also due to race, like, a whole other bunch of shit. Like, yeah.

  Matt Slayer It's crazy. Like, I've talked about this on air, too. It's like, oh, yeah. Segregation was in our parents fuckin lifetimes.

  Christoph Paul No, they they. So you had, like, white guys who could get, like, a wife right away and not have to deal with deal with competing with women and black people getting jobs. So they got good jobs, and it's like, yeah, you you got, you got a good life because of awful shit. You know, I rather fucking I have a shitty life and struggle.

  Christoph Paul Then I have women have choices and black people not be allowed to work or live it's like fuck off, you know, like that or just.

  Matt Slayer Have menial fucking jobs like.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, yeah. Like there's more important things, but.

  Matt Slayer It'll be interesting to see what the history books say about this time and.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, yeah, I agree, I agree. I mean, we had a crazy, crazy kind of six years honestly you had the 1980s from prison was wild and that's just wild shit. But you had a reality TV show guys become president, you had a.

  Matt Slayer Giant fraud of a reality TV.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. Like, not even like, you know, I mean.

  Matt Slayer It wasn't even Mark Cuban.

  Christoph Paul I'm like a big sports guy, you know, I don't talk about it too much, but I, you know, so I knew about it. I knew like he was a scumbag for like, because he, he, like, literally got a football league, did all this for just being such a bad business person. Like back in the eighties, the XFL how.

  Matt Slayer Do you bankrupt a casino?

  Christoph Paul How could that that's huge. Like you, that means you have just such hubris and stupid ideas, you know? So I mean, but, you know, I just think we all have these blind spots. That's what I learn, man. Like, I'll see people this way. There's certain dudes like Trump, Ian, they're like, they're just dudes. They're like, these guys are strong.

  Christoph Paul They're just they we all have base instincts. And Trump and Ellen a lot of these guys are really good to playing for certain people, you know, people they might not have a good, like, empathy, but they're they're logical, and they, like, they're good at sizing up other dudes. Like, this is a powerful dude. And there's like, that's the guy.

  Christoph Paul And and then you'll have, like, you know, more liberal people, women and more like kind of sensitive dudes. And they'll be like this. They'll see these con artists, like, I'm Mr. Wolk, and I'm going to make sure everybody's happy and they're trying to either get later money out of or both are both, honestly, both. And you can do that.

  Christoph Paul So it's like they have a blind spot to like. I mean, I'm pretty good at not having I can kind of see both shit and that's what makes me a good editor. That's my job is to just let's take the bullshit out. So it's a curse in a way because I'm like, I'm never falling for bullshit. I'm like, No, this guy's full of shit.

  Christoph Paul I remember there was like this genre called alt lit, and these guys were all like, We are. We're not into toxic masculinity. And this and that. Even before that was a term like, we are true artists. And I'm like, These guys are just trying to get pussy. I like this is what's going on. These guys just want to sleep with like cool hipster girls.

  Matt Slayer I mean, who doesn't?

  Christoph Paul And that's cool. I like cool hipster girls too, but they presented themselves as these other kind of guys. We're not like the jocks or this or that. Then all of a sudden rape charge is statutory rape. All these, like, fucking all the guys. And I'm like, I'm like, I saw this. It just it's. It's like a gift and a curse.

  Christoph Paul Like, I'm like, I fall through this. These guys are all con artists. And I said that with, like, political people, like, on the left, too.

  Matt Slayer And, well, the problem is blind tribalism.

  Christoph Paul All right, tribalism. Yeah. So, like, oh, this person says that, so they must be good. And if you don't have that extra $0.06, which most people don't like, I like, I'm good at seeing potential. Like, there's this I have like a sixth sense for certain things, certain things I'm totally blind stupid fuck about. But you know, certain things I can see and people don't see it.

  Christoph Paul It's obvious to me, but like other people will not see it.

  Matt Slayer I guess I'm just a pessimist. You're a scumbag. They'll proven innocent.

  Christoph Paul No, that's a good way. I mean, that's kind of old school. You I mean, that's a good philosophy to be, you know, maybe in the short term, it's kind of rough to build friendships and relationships that way. Oh, no.

  Matt Slayer I like some scumbags.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, no, but you're, you know, you're not going to get fucked that way. Hopefully not. Yeah, hopefully not. It'll be hard. It's a lot harder to get fucked that way when you have that mentality. But, yeah, people are just blind. Oh, this person says they're nice for this. No, they're a fucking asshole. They're a scumbag. They're a con artist.

  Christoph Paul Like. Well.

  Matt Slayer I don't know. In my personal, it's like most of the times when someone has to tell you that they're something they're not exactly actions.

  Christoph Paul I mean, it's like the cliche is of, like, actions, not words. That's how, you know.

  Matt Slayer Have you ever met someone who's like, I'm a nice guy? Who's a nice guy?

  Christoph Paul No, no, I it never is that way of maybe if you say I'm a decent guy, that's I can trust a guy who says I'm a decent guy. I try my best but even then, you don't know.

  Matt Slayer I still believe you at the point where you have to try to sell me on you being a decent ass.

  Christoph Paul You don't really if you have to say you're right, if you have to say it, you know.

  Matt Slayer Like your actions, if you like, you do decent shit like, oh, hey, I've had this insane. You come fucking home now. You're a decent human being. Yeah.

  Christoph Paul I agree.

  Matt Slayer But the point where you're like, Oh, I'm a nice guy. Like, I do not know. You're not. You're you're just trying to limit yourself and other people.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, you just like the idea of you being something you're not. Yeah. And you think it's going to get you something being labeled as a nice guy.

  Matt Slayer Yeah. You're going to convince people like, oh, yeah, he's such a nice guy. No.

  Christoph Paul There's not fucking. But, yeah.

  Matt Slayer It's like someone saying I'm a genius. You're not?

  Christoph Paul No.

  Matt Slayer Little Kanye anyone who proclaims to be a fucking genius is not because real smart people are so full of fucking doubt.

  Christoph Paul Yes. No, this is having to work with very smart people, like genius level, smart people. They do not have an intellectual like hubris. Is there? Yeah. They don't have it. They don't have it. You know.

  Matt Slayer I'm sure they're full of self-doubt and probably need reassurances from you that, like, their shit's good at times.

  Christoph Paul Yeah. No, I mean, it's interesting being an editor working with, like, some PhD people and, like, they're full of doubt, you know, they are, they are not. They know they have value they're not there. There's a humility to them. You know, they're never going to call themselves a fucking genius.

  Matt Slayer Sometimes I'm a little envious of stupid, pretty people.

  Christoph Paul Yeah.

  Matt Slayer Because they could just kind of slide through life at times, just like a lot of hand them shit.

  Christoph Paul Yeah.

  Matt Slayer And they don't have that self-doubt because they don't know any fucking because the fucking morons yeah.

  Christoph Paul No, it's ignorance. I mean, it is bliss. And then it's like you're older and then you're not as pretty and you're not as that. And then life kind of sucks, so I don't know.

  Matt Slayer Yeah, but I wasn't expecting to be this old, so.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, you know, it's true. It's true.

  Matt Slayer There is a definitely a good chunk of my life where 30 was a fictional age.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, look.

  Matt Slayer It's pretty. That's what fucking parents. Yeah. 30.

  Christoph Paul I'm fading a little and it's catching up to me every day.

  Matt Slayer It's okay. We're actually going to call last call and what the fuck. Yeah, we've been gone two and a half hours already.

  Christoph Paul Oh, shit. I was like, Oh, that's good, man. I didn't. I thought, like, maybe we were like, an hour and a half. I'm like, Oh, shit, I hope I'm starting to crash, but this has been a fucking awesome fuck.

  Matt Slayer Yeah. No, I was boss, and we probably will keep going if you like. I'm well.

  Christoph Paul No, like, it hit me because I'm like, it's like two, and now I'm feeling I got pitch to memoirs this week, and every fair, they will come up to me like, I have a story to tell you. And it's the fucking most boring story ever. And they'll give me a book that they've already self-published thinking I'll publish it, and it just.

  Christoph Paul It wears you down. It just. You're just sad for these people. You see, people pay, like, $1,000 to be at this book fair, and they sell three books, and it's very sad. And then you see people's dreams kind of die that they shouldn't maybe have the dream in the first place.

  Matt Slayer So if they were smart, it'd have self-awareness. I wouldn't do it.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, no, that's. I think that's the biggest thing I see the biggest flaw in the arts. If you don't have self-awareness, you're you're so far and you're. Oh, fuck.

  Matt Slayer Yeah. I said this to people all the time. Like, one of the things I love about L.A., I know we were going to rap, but, well, things are low. Morale is you're surrounded by people that are actively trying to pursue their creative goals.

  Christoph Paul Yes, I love being here, by the way. It's fucking great. It's a great energy.

  Matt Slayer But some of us are delusional. Like, statistically, yes. Some sort of fucking delusion. And something's wrong with you if you're going to kill the question. Like, am I one of the delusional ones?

  Christoph Paul Yes. You have to have that moment. You have to. I mean, for me, I think this is good to, like, in on like, for me, it's become more purpose, you know, like, this is just kind of my purpose. I don't get caught up as much in the result, you know, like for the press, we do need to make a certain amount of money, and that's fine.

  Christoph Paul But you know, it was tough. It was tough in those first couple of years. You're like, all right, I'm not making Mandy money anymore. Do I? Do I go back to school or I, you know, ride the South or, you know, use some of that money and try this publishing thing? You know, I mean, music, it's kind of fun for me.

  Christoph Paul It's not I'm not dependent on it being successful. But I kind of maybe it has more of an upside in a weird way because I'm you know, I'm just doing it for the love of it. And who knows, you know, who knows? Maybe they'll be a cuckold craze. You never know. Cuckold rock could happen. I mean, just. But you do it.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, it's the purpose. I mean, if it's ego based or you're trying to get validation, I think that's when things get bad, you know? And if you're willing to, like, learn, that's the thing. Like, people who are like, yeah, let me just kind of learn. I'll do you. I'm me, and I'm going to keep being me, but I'm also going to learn and how to connect better.

  Christoph Paul Whatever your art form is, you got a shot. You want to just be able to have a shot.

  Matt Slayer Yeah. And it's also what are your overall goals like?

  Christoph Paul Yes, that is huge.

  Matt Slayer Do you know, I don't want to be rich and fucking famous. I don't want to be Joe Rogan, I don't want to be that tier of fuckin podcasting. I would love to just be able to comfortably pay my bills from doing this.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, I mean, I'm in a fortunate place where I the, the, you know, I'm able I was able to do that with my writing, which I was able to do for like a year or two, which is an amazing thing. I'm in an anomaly I'm in a very low percentage. I mean, I was writing fucking the ridiculous books ever.

  Christoph Paul So that's the thing. It's like there's trade offs, like it wasn't here's my heart and soul in a book and here's give me six figures. No, it was me talking about Jesus coming on Kirk Cameron, and he's made out of cheese. That's my writer's success. It doesn't come how you want it to come either, you know? It's just it's a weird game.

  Matt Slayer Oh, yeah. I'm sure it happens for a lot of musicians, too. How many, like, really talented musicians are hired guns and so band that they would have never formed in a million years.

  Christoph Paul It happens a lot. It happens a lot. And sometimes that's the band that breaks through and they're like, Fuck it, I'm getting paid. I'm doing something I love. It's there are compromises. There's not. I think that's the thing. If you're looking for purity while doing art, you're going to be it's going to be hard. It's going to be really hard unless you want that to be kind of like a part time, job type purpose thing.

  Christoph Paul That's okay. That's fine.

  Matt Slayer Yeah. If you want to be a hobbyist at it.

  Christoph Paul Yeah.

  Matt Slayer Do it completely for you.

  Christoph Paul And there's nothing wrong with that. Like, and you'll get I noticed people get into fights like writers because it's like some people are just it's their hobby and some people are like, Hey, I'm actually trying to pay my mortgage. Writing a lot of books, you know, the you have to be prolific if you're going to make money writing that, you know, so you just got to find what works for you, you know?

  Christoph Paul And it's each person's different.

  Matt Slayer And you got to make some compromises along the.

  Christoph Paul Way. Yeah. You got to pick what's worth fighting, what's not, you know, I mean, for me, you know, like with class, I mean, I was like, okay, I mean, I saw we like filled and we filled a niche, you know, and sometimes it is and I saw like, okay, there's not a place for Asians are not wanting to publish cuckold books.

  Christoph Paul They're not, you know what I mean? Like, All right, I'll publish this fucking awesome cocktail book because your guys are too scared to try it. And I think we're going to and we did it did really well. You know what I mean? So that was my niche is like, let's find quality literature that agents in the Big Four are just a little too nervous to touch.

  Christoph Paul And that's become kind of our bread and butter you know, music. I don't know. I mean, if there's a rock revival, great. I'm just making music I really want to hear. And that that's good enough for me with music. Yeah.

  Matt Slayer Yeah, and there's nothing wrong with that. Yeah. Oh, if you're not going to cry yourself to sleep at night because you're not making any music.

  Christoph Paul That's fine. Yeah, well, good. I wanted to have something that I felt had a shot that was important to me. I feel like I'm jumping back in. I want to please feel there's a shot. You know, we're made. We have fans. Like, we are already ahead of the game. Like we're a brand new band, and we have fans that actually want to hear our music.

  Christoph Paul And we've played three shows, so who knows? Who knows? Like, I might come back a year, three years from now, I'd be like, Oh yeah, we're fucking signed. Or this or that. Who knows?

  Matt Slayer I'm holding him to that. He'll come back in three years. He won't be so famous that they do the show because.

  Christoph Paul That's how we'll do the show. Even if we we get lucky with a rock revival. That's what we'll be. Yeah, if that happens, who knows?

  Matt Slayer But I'll hold you to it. But we really are going to call last call. We're really going.

  Christoph Paul To and this is awesome.

  Matt Slayer Because where can they find you? Where can they find the press like, yeah. Now do the plugs.

  Christoph Paul Yeah, so I'll do the plugs. Class books dot com like the band, the class. Check us out there. We got bookstores are our books for sale. I got to still fix the fucking Dionysus website, but we're dying, I suspect, on Spotify and YouTube I mean, you know, you don't really need a fucking website these days, but I am going to make one.

  Christoph Paul But for now, the evil great Spotify, that's where it's at. Sorry if six if you're I don't think you're listening to this. Evil sex is very anti Spotify, but yeah, that's the probably the best place to find. The band denies this fact. I don't know when this is coming on. A couple.

  Matt Slayer Of weeks.

  Christoph Paul A couple of weeks. All right. So yeah. So check out Darrell. Check out the get lo cover. Keep an eye out in mid-June. Still some ways away we'll have don't you tell me maybe I'll have a Porg video. Maybe not. We'll see. You know.

  Matt Slayer So we can make out see.

  Christoph Paul What we can make happen. And, you know, oh, yeah. I have some books, the books that I like. Check out horror film poems. That's a cool one if you like. Ha. I wrote a collection of horror poems. It's kind of a cult book. And yeah, my other books just went out of print it actually. I was going to say, Oh, yeah, that's a good one, too, but it's out of print, so I got to find a new home for it.

  Christoph Paul But that's a good one. Check out class. I'm more of a publisher and writer these days. If you do want to look up Manny to Sandra, her books are still there. I don't know when the park edition is going to come out. I'm hoping for the summer, but who knows? Who knows? But yeah, she's she's around and hopefully she'll still get back to school.

  Christoph Paul Finished jamming as well. And I think that's my plus. Fuck yeah, man.

  Matt Slayer Awesome, awesome pleasure to have you. And as always, you can find me up. Matt Underscore Slater on Twitter, Metzler on Instagram, Madoff and Slayer on Facebook, Twitch TV slash Madoff. And so you can find the patron with bonus content and other shenanigans that page on RT.com slash Metzler. You can find the podcast in and now we drink on Twitter and now we learn how to score on Instagram.

  Matt Slayer Until next week. Drink up, motherfuckers.

  Christoph Paul Nice chairs.